Hey Gene.
I don't know of such a list, nor, indeed, many mailing lists of this specific nature. You could always post to BlindTech, or even this list, probably, as subjects that are not altogether directly related to screen-readers seem more OK here than on the nVDA main list, for instance. I think Mozilla also has a forum of some kind on their website. Not sure how many visually impaired users there would be there, but you could still consider it a helpful resource.
I think we will see a massive influx of Firefox users starting next year, as Chrome is moving to manifest 3 and will be preventing things like ad-blockers from properly doing their jobs. So maybe the creation of such a list as you are asking for is not far off on the horizon.
-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 09:46 AM
To: JAWS support list <main@jfw.groups.io>
Subject: From Edge to Firefox
Because of all the strange behaviors that Chromium based browsers are showing with JAWS I have decided to switch to Firefox. There is a support list for visually impaired users of Thunderbird, but there doesn't appear to be a similar list for Firefox. So can anyone suggest an appropriate list where I can get any help I might need while making the transition?
Thanks!
Gene...

Hey Gene.
I don't know of such a list, nor, indeed, many mailing lists of this specific nature. You could always post to BlindTech, or even this list, probably, as subjects that are not altogether directly related to screen-readers seem more OK here than on the nVDA main list, for instance. I think Mozilla also has a forum of some kind on their website. Not sure how many visually impaired users there would be there, but you could still consider it a helpful resource.

I think we will see a massive influx of Firefox users starting next year, as Chrome is moving to manifest 3 and will be preventing things like ad-blockers from properly doing their jobs. So maybe the creation of such a list as you are asking for is not far off on the horizon.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 09:46 AM
To: JAWS support list <main@jfw.groups.io>
Subject: From Edge to Firefox

Because of all the strange behaviors that Chromium based browsers are showing with JAWS I have decided to switch to Firefox. There is a support list for visually impaired users of Thunderbird, but there doesn't appear to be a similar list for Firefox. So can anyone suggest an appropriate list where I can get any help I might need while making the transition?

Thanks!
Gene...

Hey.
I haven't really been inconvenienced by the problems you mentioned using Chrome. However, I would like to ween myself away from it, given the thing I mentioned earlier -- I don't know what I'd do without my ad-blocker and the fact that google is trying to break them is really irksome. Also, all other Chromium-based browsers will eventually probably have to switch to manifest 3 for extensions too, and then, you can say goodbye to the proper functionality of your ad-blocker. Brave might be an exception, but I have some misgivings about that one, too -- might consider using it a little more in the coming year though.
I still find Firefox to be a bit slow, and this is unfortunate. It just doesn't seem as responsive on my system as chrome does.
I also have Vivaldi, which is Chromium-based, and which I'd really love to use more, but it has some quirks which mean I haven't figured out how to best make use of it with a screen-reader. Its days of full add-blocker functionality are, of course, also numbered.
-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 11:32 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: From Edge to Firefox
You could be right there, the Chromium engine seems to be gathering a number of problems with screen readers that don't seem to be getting any attention. Problems like the screen reader suddenly losing its focus on the browser, or the cursor suddenly jumping to the beginning or the end of the page just to name two of them.
I have the documentation files already, maybe I'll just decide to start a list for visually impaired Firefox users myself.
I'm already on the Tech Talk list so I'll try there for now, but a list for visually impaired Firefox users seems like a very appealing idea.
Gene...
On 10/2/2022 11:18 AM, JM Casey wrote:

Hey Gene.
I don't know of such a list, nor, indeed, many mailing lists of this specific nature. You could always post to BlindTech, or even this list, probably, as subjects that are not altogether directly related to screen-readers seem more OK here than on the nVDA main list, for instance. I think Mozilla also has a forum of some kind on their website. Not sure how many visually impaired users there would be there, but you could still consider it a helpful resource.

I think we will see a massive influx of Firefox users starting next year, as Chrome is moving to manifest 3 and will be preventing things like ad-blockers from properly doing their jobs. So maybe the creation of such a list as you are asking for is not far off on the horizon.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 09:46 AM
To: JAWS support list <main@jfw.groups.io>
Subject: From Edge to Firefox

Because of all the strange behaviors that Chromium based browsers are showing with JAWS I have decided to switch to Firefox. There is a support list for visually impaired users of Thunderbird, but there doesn't appear to be a similar list for Firefox. So can anyone suggest an appropriate list where I can get any help I might need while making the transition?

Thanks!
Gene...

Hey.
I haven't really been inconvenienced by the problems you mentioned using Chrome. However, I would like to ween myself away from it, given the thing I mentioned earlier -- I don't know what I'd do without my ad-blocker and the fact that google is trying to break them is really irksome. Also, all other Chromium-based browsers will eventually probably have to switch to manifest 3 for extensions too, and then, you can say goodbye to the proper functionality of your ad-blocker. Brave might be an exception, but I have some misgivings about that one, too -- might consider using it a little more in the coming year though.
I still find Firefox to be a bit slow, and this is unfortunate. It just doesn't seem as responsive on my system as chrome does.
I also have Vivaldi, which is Chromium-based, and which I'd really love to use more, but it has some quirks which mean I haven't figured out how to best make use of it with a screen-reader. Its days of full add-blocker functionality are, of course, also numbered.
-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 11:32 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: From Edge to Firefox
You could be right there, the Chromium engine seems to be gathering a number of problems with screen readers that don't seem to be getting any attention. Problems like the screen reader suddenly losing its focus on the browser, or the cursor suddenly jumping to the beginning or the end of the page just to name two of them.
I have the documentation files already, maybe I'll just decide to start a list for visually impaired Firefox users myself.
I'm already on the Tech Talk list so I'll try there for now, but a list for visually impaired Firefox users seems like a very appealing idea.
Gene...
On 10/2/2022 11:18 AM, JM Casey wrote:

Hey Gene.
I don't know of such a list, nor, indeed, many mailing lists of this specific nature. You could always post to BlindTech, or even this list, probably, as subjects that are not altogether directly related to screen-readers seem more OK here than on the nVDA main list, for instance. I think Mozilla also has a forum of some kind on their website. Not sure how many visually impaired users there would be there, but you could still consider it a helpful resource.

I think we will see a massive influx of Firefox users starting next year, as Chrome is moving to manifest 3 and will be preventing things like ad-blockers from properly doing their jobs. So maybe the creation of such a list as you are asking for is not far off on the horizon.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 09:46 AM
To: JAWS support list <main@jfw.groups.io>
Subject: From Edge to Firefox

Because of all the strange behaviors that Chromium based browsers are showing with JAWS I have decided to switch to Firefox. There is a support list for visually impaired users of Thunderbird, but there doesn't appear to be a similar list for Firefox. So can anyone suggest an appropriate list where I can get any help I might need while making the transition?

Thanks!
Gene...

Hey.
I haven't really been inconvenienced by the problems you mentioned using Chrome. However, I would like to ween myself away from it, given the thing I mentioned earlier -- I don't know what I'd do without my ad-blocker and the fact that google is trying to break them is really irksome. Also, all other Chromium-based browsers will eventually probably have to switch to manifest 3 for extensions too, and then, you can say goodbye to the proper functionality of your ad-blocker. Brave might be an exception, but I have some misgivings about that one, too -- might consider using it a little more in the coming year though.
I still find Firefox to be a bit slow, and this is unfortunate. It just doesn't seem as responsive on my system as chrome does.
I also have Vivaldi, which is Chromium-based, and which I'd really love to use more, but it has some quirks which mean I haven't figured out how to best make use of it with a screen-reader. Its days of full add-blocker functionality are, of course, also numbered.


-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 11:32 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: From Edge to Firefox

You could be right there, the Chromium engine seems to be gathering a number of problems with screen readers that don't seem to be getting any attention. Problems like the screen reader suddenly losing its focus on the browser, or the cursor suddenly jumping to the beginning or the end of the page just to name two of them.

I have the documentation files already, maybe I'll just decide to start a list for visually impaired Firefox users myself.

I'm already on the Tech Talk list so I'll try there for now, but a list for visually impaired Firefox users seems like a very appealing idea.

Gene...


On 10/2/2022 11:18 AM, JM Casey wrote:

Hey Gene.
I don't know of such a list, nor, indeed, many mailing lists of this specific nature. You could always post to BlindTech, or even this list, probably, as subjects that are not altogether directly related to screen-readers seem more OK here than on the nVDA main list, for instance. I think Mozilla also has a forum of some kind on their website. Not sure how many visually impaired users there would be there, but you could still consider it a helpful resource.

I think we will see a massive influx of Firefox users starting next year, as Chrome is moving to manifest 3 and will be preventing things like ad-blockers from properly doing their jobs. So maybe the creation of such a list as you are asking for is not far off on the horizon.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 09:46 AM
To: JAWS support list <main@jfw.groups.io>
Subject: From Edge to Firefox

Because of all the strange behaviors that Chromium based browsers are showing with JAWS I have decided to switch to Firefox. There is a support list for visually impaired users of Thunderbird, but there doesn't appear to be a similar list for Firefox. So can anyone suggest an appropriate list where I can get any help I might need while making the transition?

Thanks!
Gene...

Oh, I'm sure that is google's motivation. But I’m not on the internet to please google -- only for my own benefit. And many people are very displeased about this new Google plan.
What's that approach you mean?
-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 12:04 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: From Edge to Firefox
I can understand why Google would want to prevent ad blockers from working since advertising is where they get most of their income.
I guess I'm patient because even if Firefox is slower than Chromium based browsers, I'm not worried or concerned about it.
And for blocking ads, I use an approach to blocking ads that doesn't depend on an add on and works for any browser I choose to use without needing me to do anything with the browser.
Gene...
On 10/2/2022 11:48 AM, JM Casey wrote:

Hey.
I haven't really been inconvenienced by the problems you mentioned using Chrome. However, I would like to ween myself away from it, given the thing I mentioned earlier -- I don't know what I'd do without my ad-blocker and the fact that google is trying to break them is really irksome. Also, all other Chromium-based browsers will eventually probably have to switch to manifest 3 for extensions too, and then, you can say goodbye to the proper functionality of your ad-blocker. Brave might be an exception, but I have some misgivings about that one, too -- might consider using it a little more in the coming year though.
I still find Firefox to be a bit slow, and this is unfortunate. It just doesn't seem as responsive on my system as chrome does.
I also have Vivaldi, which is Chromium-based, and which I'd really love to use more, but it has some quirks which mean I haven't figured out how to best make use of it with a screen-reader. Its days of full add-blocker functionality are, of course, also numbered.


-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 11:32 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: From Edge to Firefox

You could be right there, the Chromium engine seems to be gathering a number of problems with screen readers that don't seem to be getting any attention. Problems like the screen reader suddenly losing its focus on the browser, or the cursor suddenly jumping to the beginning or the end of the page just to name two of them.

I have the documentation files already, maybe I'll just decide to start a list for visually impaired Firefox users myself.

I'm already on the Tech Talk list so I'll try there for now, but a list for visually impaired Firefox users seems like a very appealing idea.

Gene...


On 10/2/2022 11:18 AM, JM Casey wrote:

Hey Gene.
I don't know of such a list, nor, indeed, many mailing lists of this specific nature. You could always post to BlindTech, or even this list, probably, as subjects that are not altogether directly related to screen-readers seem more OK here than on the nVDA main list, for instance. I think Mozilla also has a forum of some kind on their website. Not sure how many visually impaired users there would be there, but you could still consider it a helpful resource.

I think we will see a massive influx of Firefox users starting next year, as Chrome is moving to manifest 3 and will be preventing things like ad-blockers from properly doing their jobs. So maybe the creation of such a list as you are asking for is not far off on the horizon.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 09:46 AM
To: JAWS support list <main@jfw.groups.io>
Subject: From Edge to Firefox

Because of all the strange behaviors that Chromium based browsers are showing with JAWS I have decided to switch to Firefox. There is a support list for visually impaired users of Thunderbird, but there doesn't appear to be a similar list for Firefox. So can anyone suggest an appropriate list where I can get any help I might need while making the transition?

Thanks!
Gene...

Be careful, I have been using firefox for a while, and at least on my
system, Jaws tends to freeze up quite a lot and there are other
accessibility problems. Its a very nice browser, but Jaws does not
always get along.
On Sun, 02 Oct 2022 12:15:38 -0400,
JM Casey wrote:

Oh, I'm sure that is google's motivation. But I’m not on the internet to please google -- only for my own benefit. And many people are very displeased about this new Google plan.
What's that approach you mean?


-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 12:04 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: From Edge to Firefox

I can understand why Google would want to prevent ad blockers from working since advertising is where they get most of their income.

I guess I'm patient because even if Firefox is slower than Chromium based browsers, I'm not worried or concerned about it.

And for blocking ads, I use an approach to blocking ads that doesn't depend on an add on and works for any browser I choose to use without needing me to do anything with the browser.

Gene...


On 10/2/2022 11:48 AM, JM Casey wrote:

Hey.
I haven't really been inconvenienced by the problems you mentioned using Chrome. However, I would like to ween myself away from it, given the thing I mentioned earlier -- I don't know what I'd do without my ad-blocker and the fact that google is trying to break them is really irksome. Also, all other Chromium-based browsers will eventually probably have to switch to manifest 3 for extensions too, and then, you can say goodbye to the proper functionality of your ad-blocker. Brave might be an exception, but I have some misgivings about that one, too -- might consider using it a little more in the coming year though.
I still find Firefox to be a bit slow, and this is unfortunate. It just doesn't seem as responsive on my system as chrome does.
I also have Vivaldi, which is Chromium-based, and which I'd really love to use more, but it has some quirks which mean I haven't figured out how to best make use of it with a screen-reader. Its days of full add-blocker functionality are, of course, also numbered.


-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 11:32 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: From Edge to Firefox

You could be right there, the Chromium engine seems to be gathering a number of problems with screen readers that don't seem to be getting any attention. Problems like the screen reader suddenly losing its focus on the browser, or the cursor suddenly jumping to the beginning or the end of the page just to name two of them.

I have the documentation files already, maybe I'll just decide to start a list for visually impaired Firefox users myself.

I'm already on the Tech Talk list so I'll try there for now, but a list for visually impaired Firefox users seems like a very appealing idea.

Gene...


On 10/2/2022 11:18 AM, JM Casey wrote:

Hey Gene.
I don't know of such a list, nor, indeed, many mailing lists of this specific nature. You could always post to BlindTech, or even this list, probably, as subjects that are not altogether directly related to screen-readers seem more OK here than on the nVDA main list, for instance. I think Mozilla also has a forum of some kind on their website. Not sure how many visually impaired users there would be there, but you could still consider it a helpful resource.

I think we will see a massive influx of Firefox users starting next year, as Chrome is moving to manifest 3 and will be preventing things like ad-blockers from properly doing their jobs. So maybe the creation of such a list as you are asking for is not far off on the horizon.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 09:46 AM
To: JAWS support list <main@jfw.groups.io>
Subject: From Edge to Firefox

Because of all the strange behaviors that Chromium based browsers are showing with JAWS I have decided to switch to Firefox. There is a support list for visually impaired users of Thunderbird, but there doesn't appear to be a similar list for Firefox. So can anyone suggest an appropriate list where I can get any help I might need while making the transition?

Thanks!
Gene...

Be careful, I have been using firefox for a while, and at least on my
system, Jaws tends to freeze up quite a lot and there are other
accessibility problems. Its a very nice browser, but Jaws does not
always get along.
On Sun, 02 Oct 2022 12:15:38 -0400,
JM Casey wrote:

Oh, I'm sure that is google's motivation. But I’m not on the internet to please google -- only for my own benefit. And many people are very displeased about this new Google plan.
What's that approach you mean?


-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 12:04 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: From Edge to Firefox

I can understand why Google would want to prevent ad blockers from working since advertising is where they get most of their income.

I guess I'm patient because even if Firefox is slower than Chromium based browsers, I'm not worried or concerned about it.

And for blocking ads, I use an approach to blocking ads that doesn't depend on an add on and works for any browser I choose to use without needing me to do anything with the browser.

Gene...


On 10/2/2022 11:48 AM, JM Casey wrote:

Hey.
I haven't really been inconvenienced by the problems you mentioned using Chrome. However, I would like to ween myself away from it, given the thing I mentioned earlier -- I don't know what I'd do without my ad-blocker and the fact that google is trying to break them is really irksome. Also, all other Chromium-based browsers will eventually probably have to switch to manifest 3 for extensions too, and then, you can say goodbye to the proper functionality of your ad-blocker. Brave might be an exception, but I have some misgivings about that one, too -- might consider using it a little more in the coming year though.
I still find Firefox to be a bit slow, and this is unfortunate. It just doesn't seem as responsive on my system as chrome does.
I also have Vivaldi, which is Chromium-based, and which I'd really love to use more, but it has some quirks which mean I haven't figured out how to best make use of it with a screen-reader. Its days of full add-blocker functionality are, of course, also numbered.


-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 11:32 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: From Edge to Firefox

You could be right there, the Chromium engine seems to be gathering a number of problems with screen readers that don't seem to be getting any attention. Problems like the screen reader suddenly losing its focus on the browser, or the cursor suddenly jumping to the beginning or the end of the page just to name two of them.

I have the documentation files already, maybe I'll just decide to start a list for visually impaired Firefox users myself.

I'm already on the Tech Talk list so I'll try there for now, but a list for visually impaired Firefox users seems like a very appealing idea.

Gene...


On 10/2/2022 11:18 AM, JM Casey wrote:

Hey Gene.
I don't know of such a list, nor, indeed, many mailing lists of this specific nature. You could always post to BlindTech, or even this list, probably, as subjects that are not altogether directly related to screen-readers seem more OK here than on the nVDA main list, for instance. I think Mozilla also has a forum of some kind on their website. Not sure how many visually impaired users there would be there, but you could still consider it a helpful resource.

I think we will see a massive influx of Firefox users starting next year, as Chrome is moving to manifest 3 and will be preventing things like ad-blockers from properly doing their jobs. So maybe the creation of such a list as you are asking for is not far off on the horizon.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 09:46 AM
To: JAWS support list <main@jfw.groups.io>
Subject: From Edge to Firefox

Because of all the strange behaviors that Chromium based browsers are showing with JAWS I have decided to switch to Firefox. There is a support list for visually impaired users of Thunderbird, but there doesn't appear to be a similar list for Firefox. So can anyone suggest an appropriate list where I can get any help I might need while making the transition?

Thanks!
Gene...

On Sun, Oct 2, 2022 at 12:04 PM, Gene Warner wrote:
I can understand why Google would want to prevent ad blockers from
working since advertising is where they get most of their income.
-
Which is certainly true, but Google does not tightly control Chromium, per se, just Chrome, which is built on it.
While Chromium originated with Google, and they still are actively involved in it, it is an open-source project.  It would be considered completely unacceptable by all the other users of the Chromium code base were Google to try to insert its own advertising "needs" into that code.
I haven't used Chrome, proper, in years, preferring the privacy-focused browsers that share the Chromium base such as Brave or Vivaldi, and there are others.  And the uBlock Origin adblocker (and it's way more than just that) works beautifully in Chrome and Firefox both.  There is no way I can keep up with the appropriate things to block like the developers of these ad blocking and privacy maintaining (to the extent possible) products do.
--
Brian - Virginia, USA- Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044
*/Puritanism: The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy./*
    ~ H.L. Mencken, AKA /The Sage of Baltimore/

Oh, I'm sure that is google's motivation. But I’m not on the internet to please google -- only for my own benefit. And many people are very displeased about this new Google plan.
What's that approach you mean?


-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 12:04 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: From Edge to Firefox

I can understand why Google would want to prevent ad blockers from working since advertising is where they get most of their income.

I guess I'm patient because even if Firefox is slower than Chromium based browsers, I'm not worried or concerned about it.

And for blocking ads, I use an approach to blocking ads that doesn't depend on an add on and works for any browser I choose to use without needing me to do anything with the browser.

Gene...


On 10/2/2022 11:48 AM, JM Casey wrote:

Hey.
I haven't really been inconvenienced by the problems you mentioned using Chrome. However, I would like to ween myself away from it, given the thing I mentioned earlier -- I don't know what I'd do without my ad-blocker and the fact that google is trying to break them is really irksome. Also, all other Chromium-based browsers will eventually probably have to switch to manifest 3 for extensions too, and then, you can say goodbye to the proper functionality of your ad-blocker. Brave might be an exception, but I have some misgivings about that one, too -- might consider using it a little more in the coming year though.
I still find Firefox to be a bit slow, and this is unfortunate. It just doesn't seem as responsive on my system as chrome does.
I also have Vivaldi, which is Chromium-based, and which I'd really love to use more, but it has some quirks which mean I haven't figured out how to best make use of it with a screen-reader. Its days of full add-blocker functionality are, of course, also numbered.


-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 11:32 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: From Edge to Firefox

You could be right there, the Chromium engine seems to be gathering a number of problems with screen readers that don't seem to be getting any attention. Problems like the screen reader suddenly losing its focus on the browser, or the cursor suddenly jumping to the beginning or the end of the page just to name two of them.

I have the documentation files already, maybe I'll just decide to start a list for visually impaired Firefox users myself.

I'm already on the Tech Talk list so I'll try there for now, but a list for visually impaired Firefox users seems like a very appealing idea.

Gene...


On 10/2/2022 11:18 AM, JM Casey wrote:

Hey Gene.
I don't know of such a list, nor, indeed, many mailing lists of this specific nature. You could always post to BlindTech, or even this list, probably, as subjects that are not altogether directly related to screen-readers seem more OK here than on the nVDA main list, for instance. I think Mozilla also has a forum of some kind on their website. Not sure how many visually impaired users there would be there, but you could still consider it a helpful resource.

I think we will see a massive influx of Firefox users starting next year, as Chrome is moving to manifest 3 and will be preventing things like ad-blockers from properly doing their jobs. So maybe the creation of such a list as you are asking for is not far off on the horizon.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 09:46 AM
To: JAWS support list <main@jfw.groups.io>
Subject: From Edge to Firefox

Because of all the strange behaviors that Chromium based browsers are showing with JAWS I have decided to switch to Firefox. There is a support list for visually impaired users of Thunderbird, but there doesn't appear to be a similar list for Firefox. So can anyone suggest an appropriate list where I can get any help I might need while making the transition?

Thanks!
Gene...

Hey.
I haven't really been inconvenienced by the problems you mentioned using
Chrome. However, I would like to ween myself away from it, given the thing
I mentioned earlier -- I don't know what I'd do without my ad-blocker and
the fact that google is trying to break them is really irksome. Also, all
other Chromium-based browsers will eventually probably have to switch to
manifest 3 for extensions too, and then, you can say goodbye to the proper
functionality of your ad-blocker. Brave might be an exception, but I have
some misgivings about that one, too -- might consider using it a little
more in the coming year though.
I still find Firefox to be a bit slow, and this is unfortunate. It just
doesn't seem as responsive on my system as chrome does.
I also have Vivaldi, which is Chromium-based, and which I'd really love to
use more, but it has some quirks which mean I haven't figured out how to
best make use of it with a screen-reader. Its days of full add-blocker
functionality are, of course, also numbered.


-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 11:32 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: From Edge to Firefox

You could be right there, the Chromium engine seems to be gathering a
number of problems with screen readers that don't seem to be getting any
attention. Problems like the screen reader suddenly losing its focus on
the browser, or the cursor suddenly jumping to the beginning or the end of
the page just to name two of them.

I have the documentation files already, maybe I'll just decide to start a
list for visually impaired Firefox users myself.

I'm already on the Tech Talk list so I'll try there for now, but a list
for visually impaired Firefox users seems like a very appealing idea.

Gene...


On 10/2/2022 11:18 AM, JM Casey wrote:

Hey Gene.
I don't know of such a list, nor, indeed, many mailing lists of this
specific nature. You could always post to BlindTech, or even this list,
probably, as subjects that are not altogether directly related to
screen-readers seem more OK here than on the nVDA main list, for
instance. I think Mozilla also has a forum of some kind on their website.
Not sure how many visually impaired users there would be there, but you
could still consider it a helpful resource.

I think we will see a massive influx of Firefox users starting next year,
as Chrome is moving to manifest 3 and will be preventing things like
ad-blockers from properly doing their jobs. So maybe the creation of such
a list as you are asking for is not far off on the horizon.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 09:46 AM
To: JAWS support list <main@jfw.groups.io>
Subject: From Edge to Firefox

Because of all the strange behaviors that Chromium based browsers are
showing with JAWS I have decided to switch to Firefox. There is a support
list for visually impaired users of Thunderbird, but there doesn't appear
to be a similar list for Firefox. So can anyone suggest an appropriate
list where I can get any help I might need while making the transition?

Thanks!
Gene...

Oh, I'm sure that is google's motivation. But I’m not on the internet to
please google -- only for my own benefit. And many people are very
displeased about this new Google plan.
What's that approach you mean?


-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 12:04 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: From Edge to Firefox

I can understand why Google would want to prevent ad blockers from working
since advertising is where they get most of their income.

I guess I'm patient because even if Firefox is slower than Chromium based
browsers, I'm not worried or concerned about it.

And for blocking ads, I use an approach to blocking ads that doesn't
depend on an add on and works for any browser I choose to use without
needing me to do anything with the browser.

Gene...


On 10/2/2022 11:48 AM, JM Casey wrote:

Hey.
I haven't really been inconvenienced by the problems you mentioned using
Chrome. However, I would like to ween myself away from it, given the
thing I mentioned earlier -- I don't know what I'd do without my
ad-blocker and the fact that google is trying to break them is really
irksome. Also, all other Chromium-based browsers will eventually
probably have to switch to manifest 3 for extensions too, and then, you
can say goodbye to the proper functionality of your ad-blocker. Brave
might be an exception, but I have some misgivings about that one, too --
might consider using it a little more in the coming year though.
I still find Firefox to be a bit slow, and this is unfortunate. It just
doesn't seem as responsive on my system as chrome does.
I also have Vivaldi, which is Chromium-based, and which I'd really love
to use more, but it has some quirks which mean I haven't figured out how
to best make use of it with a screen-reader. Its days of full
add-blocker functionality are, of course, also numbered.


-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 11:32 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: From Edge to Firefox

You could be right there, the Chromium engine seems to be gathering a
number of problems with screen readers that don't seem to be getting any
attention. Problems like the screen reader suddenly losing its focus on
the browser, or the cursor suddenly jumping to the beginning or the end
of the page just to name two of them.

I have the documentation files already, maybe I'll just decide to start
a list for visually impaired Firefox users myself.

I'm already on the Tech Talk list so I'll try there for now, but a list
for visually impaired Firefox users seems like a very appealing idea.

Gene...


On 10/2/2022 11:18 AM, JM Casey wrote:

Hey Gene.
I don't know of such a list, nor, indeed, many mailing lists of this
specific nature. You could always post to BlindTech, or even this list,
probably, as subjects that are not altogether directly related to
screen-readers seem more OK here than on the nVDA main list, for
instance. I think Mozilla also has a forum of some kind on their
website. Not sure how many visually impaired users there would be
there, but you could still consider it a helpful resource.

I think we will see a massive influx of Firefox users starting next
year, as Chrome is moving to manifest 3 and will be preventing things
like ad-blockers from properly doing their jobs. So maybe the creation
of such a list as you are asking for is not far off on the horizon.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gene
Warner
Sent: October 2, 2022 09:46 AM
To: JAWS support list <main@jfw.groups.io>
Subject: From Edge to Firefox

Because of all the strange behaviors that Chromium based browsers are
showing with JAWS I have decided to switch to Firefox. There is a
support list for visually impaired users of Thunderbird, but there
doesn't appear to be a similar list for Firefox. So can anyone suggest
an appropriate list where I can get any help I might need while making
the transition?

Thanks!
Gene...

On Sun, Oct 2, 2022 at 12:04 PM, Gene Warner wrote:

I can understand why Google would want to prevent ad blockers from
working since advertising is where they get most of their income.

-
Which is certainly true, but Google does not tightly control Chromium,
per se, just Chrome, which is built on it.

While Chromium originated with Google, and they still are actively
involved in it, it is an open-source project. It would be considered
completely unacceptable by all the other users of the Chromium code base
were Google to try to insert its own advertising "needs" into that code.

I haven't used Chrome, proper, in years, preferring the privacy-focused
browsers that share the Chromium base such as Brave or Vivaldi, and
there are others. And the uBlock Origin adblocker (and it's way more
than just that) works beautifully in Chrome and Firefox both. There is
no way I can keep up with the appropriate things to block like the
developers of these ad blocking and privacy maintaining (to the extent
possible) products do.
--

Brian - Virginia, USA- Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044

*/Puritanism: The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy./*

~ H.L. Mencken, AKA /The Sage of Baltimore/

On Sun, Oct 2, 2022 at 01:04 PM, JM Casey wrote:

I'm a little skeptical whether it's as effective as an ad-blocker, or else they woudlnt' be used by some of the very tech-savvy people I know who do use them.

-
Your skepticism is warranted.  These purpose-dedicated tools did not come into existence because the hosts file "can do it all."  Not to mention no end user is as likely to be able to keep up on all the hosts that need to be blocked as organizations dedicated to security and ad-blocking do.

There's more, a lot more, to ad blocking than the hosts file, and all you need to do is look at any one of the common subscription lists used by multiple ad-blockers to see just how much more.
--

Brian - Virginia, USA - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Puritanism: The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy.

    ~ H.L. Mencken, AKA The Sage of Baltimore