Date
1 - 12 of 12
Moderated Itunes with Jaws 2021
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Tony Sohl <tonysohl@...>
Hi yes you are all correct apple has made no attempts to make their itues software accessible with JAWS!
One solution I would do if you have aira is have them help you by having aira log into the computer with team viewer and then telling the aria agent what you ant to do for example moving music from widnwos into itues and then having them transfer it to your iphone or ipdad. I know most of you want to do thsi independently but Apple will not make any changes to their program. Unfortunately, if you have a mac then it works properly, howveer most people wnat a pc and they should make changes to. I wonder if we should all write apple and demand they fix this. I know the NFB sued apple for accessability and maybe it's time for that to hapen again or the acb necds to put a fire uncder them! I hope this heops. |
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Marty Hutchings
I am using iTunes latest version with JAWS 21 latest build and Windows 7. I have an iPod Shuffle 4th Generation, iPod Touch 6th Generation, iPhone SE and an iPhone 8. Although it is a bit cumbersome, like it has been said earlier in this thread, Tab And Shift Tab are your friend. The Alt Key will get you into the menus, although nothing is spoken until you hit the Down arrow after pressing Alt.
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It does seem that Freedom Scientific could spend more time configuring JAWS to work with more commercial programs, or Apple could make their programs accessible, but there are some incredibly talented script writers out there that I am sure, could put something together that would make iTunes a little more screen reader friendly. How about it anyone? Love in Christ Marty If we view this present life as our primary goal, we will agree with William Shakespeare who said: “Life is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.” From TODAY IN THE WORD June 1, 2020 -----Original Message-----
From: Tony Sohl Sent: Friday, February 19, 2021 11:04 AM To: main@jfw.groups.io Subject: Itunes with Jaws 2021 Hi yes you are all correct apple has made no attempts to make their itues software accessible with JAWS! One solution I would do if you have aira is have them help you by having aira log into the computer with team viewer and then telling the aria agent what you ant to do for example moving music from widnwos into itues and then having them transfer it to your iphone or ipdad. I know most of you want to do thsi independently but Apple will not make any changes to their program. Unfortunately, if you have a mac then it works properly, howveer most people wnat a pc and they should make changes to. I wonder if we should all write apple and demand they fix this. I know the NFB sued apple for accessability and maybe it's time for that to hapen again or the acb necds to put a fire uncder them! I hope this heops. |
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paul lemm
Hi,
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I'm not sure why people are saying iTunes isn't accessible, although it may not be the best layout for a screen reader, as far as I'm aware its fully accessible. I don't use it much and maybe there are features I'm not using which aren't accessible, but I can add music to the library, create playlists, transfer music to my iphone and manage my iPhone from within itunes all without any sighted assistance using only jaws. I know others have already suggested using shift and tab to navigate, also F6 and shift F6 are two other really handy keystrokes which move you between sections. Rather than having to cycle through each option as you do when tabbing, F6 quickly moves you from one section to another, meaning less key presses to navigate between different sections of the program. Paul Lemm -----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tony Sohl Sent: 19 February 2021 17:05 To: main@jfw.groups.io Subject: Itunes with Jaws 2021 Hi yes you are all correct apple has made no attempts to make their itues software accessible with JAWS! One solution I would do if you have aira is have them help you by having aira log into the computer with team viewer and then telling the aria agent what you ant to do for example moving music from widnwos into itues and then having them transfer it to your iphone or ipdad. I know most of you want to do thsi independently but Apple will not make any changes to their program. Unfortunately, if you have a mac then it works properly, howveer most people wnat a pc and they should make changes to. I wonder if we should all write apple and demand they fix this. I know the NFB sued apple for accessability and maybe it's time for that to hapen again or the acb necds to put a fire uncder them! I hope this heops. |
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Richard Turner <richardturner42@...>
It is accessible in the most minimalist definition of accessible.
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Richard Ralph's Observation: It is a mistake to allow any mechanical object<>to realize that you are in a hurry. My web site, www.turner42.com -----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of paul lemm via groups.io Sent: Friday, February 19, 2021 3:22 PM To: main@jfw.groups.io Subject: Re: Itunes with Jaws 2021 Hi, I'm not sure why people are saying iTunes isn't accessible, although it may not be the best layout for a screen reader, as far as I'm aware its fully accessible. I don't use it much and maybe there are features I'm not using which aren't accessible, but I can add music to the library, create playlists, transfer music to my iphone and manage my iPhone from within itunes all without any sighted assistance using only jaws. I know others have already suggested using shift and tab to navigate, also F6 and shift F6 are two other really handy keystrokes which move you between sections. Rather than having to cycle through each option as you do when tabbing, F6 quickly moves you from one section to another, meaning less key presses to navigate between different sections of the program. Paul Lemm -----Original Message----- From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tony Sohl Sent: 19 February 2021 17:05 To: main@jfw.groups.io Subject: Itunes with Jaws 2021 Hi yes you are all correct apple has made no attempts to make their itues software accessible with JAWS! One solution I would do if you have aira is have them help you by having aira log into the computer with team viewer and then telling the aria agent what you ant to do for example moving music from widnwos into itues and then having them transfer it to your iphone or ipdad. I know most of you want to do thsi independently but Apple will not make any changes to their program. Unfortunately, if you have a mac then it works properly, howveer most people wnat a pc and they should make changes to. I wonder if we should all write apple and demand they fix this. I know the NFB sued apple for accessability and maybe it's time for that to hapen again or the acb necds to put a fire uncder them! I hope this heops. |
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Marty Hutchings
Hay, Thanks for the information about Shift F6 and F6. That should help a lot. Are there any other keyboard short cuts that I am not aware of?
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Love in Christ Marty If we view this present life as our primary goal, we will agree with William Shakespeare who said: “Life is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.” From TODAY IN THE WORD June 1, 2020 -----Original Message-----
From: paul lemm via groups.io Sent: Friday, February 19, 2021 5:21 PM To: main@jfw.groups.io Subject: Re: Itunes with Jaws 2021 Hi, I'm not sure why people are saying iTunes isn't accessible, although it may not be the best layout for a screen reader, as far as I'm aware its fully accessible. I don't use it much and maybe there are features I'm not using which aren't accessible, but I can add music to the library, create playlists, transfer music to my iphone and manage my iPhone from within itunes all without any sighted assistance using only jaws. I know others have already suggested using shift and tab to navigate, also F6 and shift F6 are two other really handy keystrokes which move you between sections. Rather than having to cycle through each option as you do when tabbing, F6 quickly moves you from one section to another, meaning less key presses to navigate between different sections of the program. Paul Lemm -----Original Message----- From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tony Sohl Sent: 19 February 2021 17:05 To: main@jfw.groups.io Subject: Itunes with Jaws 2021 Hi yes you are all correct apple has made no attempts to make their itues software accessible with JAWS! One solution I would do if you have aira is have them help you by having aira log into the computer with team viewer and then telling the aria agent what you ant to do for example moving music from widnwos into itues and then having them transfer it to your iphone or ipdad. I know most of you want to do thsi independently but Apple will not make any changes to their program. Unfortunately, if you have a mac then it works properly, howveer most people wnat a pc and they should make changes to. I wonder if we should all write apple and demand they fix this. I know the NFB sued apple for accessability and maybe it's time for that to hapen again or the acb necds to put a fire uncder them! I hope this heops. |
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Udo Egner-Walter
Hi Marty,
You wrote: It does seem that Freedom Scientific could spend more time configuring JAWS to work with more commercial programs, or Apple could make their programs accessible, but there are some incredibly talented script writers out there that I am sure, could put something together that would make iTunes a little more screen reader friendly. How about it anyone?I understand your frustration very much as I sometimes feel very similar. But unfortunately the problem is much more complex than just writing a few scripts. In principle, it works like this: The manufacturer of an operating system sets the guidelines by determining which interfaces are available for screen readers. The latest interface, for example, which is also used by all applications from the Microsoft Store, is called UIA. Windows does provide some support for standard controls out of the box, but this is not quite enough for the screen reader to be able to handle them. For example, it is up to the developer of applications to name the controls correctly, to provide help texts or to give unique names to controls so that they can be found on the screen via script. And now imagine that an application uses its own components and these components do not support these technologies. For example, any application can draw a picture, put a frame around it and claim that is a button. But it is not. And if the corresponding interfaces are not integrated by the developer, it is not even possible to get informations such as the name. Out of curiosity, I downloaded the iTunes application from the Microsoft Store yesterday. Some things could certainly be adapted and extended through scripts. But when I look at the table, for example, where all the albums and songs are displayed, no information is provided by the program itself. This information is visible on the screen for sighted people, but the screen reader cannot determine anything here. To my opinion either Freedom Scientific nor scripters out there couldn't do anything, perhaps implant some function to OCR the control or similar things. But these are hacks and tricks and don't ground on the accessibility framework from Microsoft and the correct implantation of this framework from the developer. Kind regards Udo Am 19.02.2021 um 21:25 schrieb Marty Hutchings <mhutchings152730@...>: |
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John Covici
I think that was not the correct place to download the itunes
applications, just go to apple.com and download the installer from there and maybe you'd get a better idea. On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 11:05:48 -0500, Udo Egner-Walter via groups.io wrote: -- Your life is like a penny. You're going to lose it. The question is: How do you spend it? John Covici wb2una covici@... |
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Patrick Murphy <murphy.patrick42@...>
I downloaded it from apple, and still there were the same problems.
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The ms app from the store was worse!! Pat Sent from my gmail account. -----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of John Covici Sent: Tuesday 23 February 2021 06:52 To: main@jfw.groups.io Subject: Re: Itunes with Jaws 2021 I think that was not the correct place to download the itunes applications, just go to apple.com and download the installer from there and maybe you'd get a better idea. On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 11:05:48 -0500, Udo Egner-Walter via groups.io wrote: JAWS to work with more commercial programs, or Apple could make their programs accessible, but there are some incredibly talented script writers out there that I am sure, could put something together that would make iTunes a little more screen reader friendly. How about it anyone? But unfortunately the problem is much more complex than just writing a few scripts. sets the guidelines by determining which interfaces are available for screen readers. The latest interface, for example, which is also used by all applications from the Microsoft Store, is called UIA. Windows does provide some support for standard controls out of the box, but this is not quite enough for the screen reader to be able to handle them. For example, it is up to the developer of applications to name the controls correctly, to provide help texts or to give unique names to controls so that they can be found on the screen via script. components do not support these technologies. For example, any application can draw a picture, put a frame around it and claim that is a button. But it is not. And if the corresponding interfaces are not integrated by the developer, it is not even possible to get informations such as the name. Store yesterday. Some things could certainly be adapted and extended through scripts. But when I look at the table, for example, where all the albums and songs are displayed, no information is provided by the program itself. This information is visible on the screen for sighted people, but the screen reader cannot determine anything here. To my opinion either Freedom Scientific nor scripters out there couldn't do anything, perhaps implant some function to OCR the control or similar things. But these are hacks and tricks and don't ground on the accessibility framework from Microsoft and the correct implantation of this framework from the developer. <mhutchings152730@...>: 7. I have an iPod Shuffle 4th Generation, iPod Touch 6th Generation, iPhone SE and an iPhone 8. Although it is a bit cumbersome, like it has been said earlier in this thread, Tab And Shift Tab are your friend. The Alt Key will get you into the menus, although nothing is spoken until you hit the Down arrow after pressing Alt. JAWS to work with more commercial programs, or Apple could make theirIt does seem that Freedom Scientific could spend more time configuring programs accessible, but there are some incredibly talented script writers out there that I am sure, could put something together that would make iTunes a little more screen reader friendly. How about it anyone? William Shakespeare who said: "Life is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing." From TODAY IN THE WORD June 1, 2020 -------Original Message----- From: Tony Sohl Your life is like a penny. You're going to lose it. The question is: How do you spend it? John Covici wb2una covici@... |
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Udo Egner-Walter
Hi John, You wrote:
There are two versions of iTunes available. The newest one is the iTunes app you can download from Microsoft Store. You can still download the older one from the Apple homepage, that's right, but this version - at least as far as I know - will not developed further any more. So sooner or later you will be forced to change to the new app You've probably heard of Windows 10 S, the OS version allowing only installations of apps from Microsoft Store. In this article: you can read that Windows 10 S was leading Apple to develop the Microsoft Store version. By the way, the benefit of using the app from Microsoft Store is a clean install. If you install the old native app you will get services from Apple installed too, for example Bonjour. Because all of this I tried the Microsoft Store app first. Best wishes Udo |
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K0LNY
How will screenreaders do this?
Will Jaws and NVDA have apps on the Microsoft
store?
Another good reason to lean more towards
Linux.
Glenn ----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, February 23, 2021 10:27 AM
Subject: Re: Itunes with Jaws 2021 Hi
John,
You
wrote:
There
are two versions of iTunes available. The newest one is the iTunes app you can
download from Microsoft Store. You can still download the older one from the
Apple homepage, that's right, but this version - at least as far as I know -
will not developed further any more. So sooner or later you will be forced to
change to the new app
You've
probably heard of Windows 10 S, the OS version allowing only installations of
apps from Microsoft Store. In this article:
you
can read that Windows 10 S was leading Apple to develop the Microsoft Store
version. By the way, the benefit of using the app from Microsoft Store is a
clean install. If you install the old native app you will get services from
Apple installed too, for example Bonjour.
Because
all of this I tried the Microsoft Store app first.
Best
wishes
Udo
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John Covici
OK, I did not know about this. I will never be able to use that
version of windows. On Tue, 23 Feb 2021 11:27:09 -0500, Udo Egner-Walter via groups.io wrote: -- Your life is like a penny. You're going to lose it. The question is: How do you spend it? John Covici wb2una covici@... |
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Udo Egner-Walter
Hi Glenn,
you wrote: How will screenreaders do this?No one can see into the future and see what's happening. But you shouldn't be fearful about this. In different post I could read that Microsoft Store isn't as successful as for example the Apple Store or Google Store. Vendors have to pay money to publish their apps in Microsoft Store and not all of them are willing to do this. And even if there's only one App Store to download apps you can be sure the screenreader companies will adapt to this situation. But this is far far away, at least to my opinion. Further you wrote: Another good reason to lean more towards Linux.As far as I know it's hard to deal with Linux as a blind or visually impaired person. I won't say this is impossible but to my opinion you have to restrict yourself in using Linux. Maybe a Mac could be an alternative for you - I know a view people using it or using Windows and a Mac at the same time (me too). Best wishes Udo |
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