Topics

keystrokes for pop-ups


pmbeardy@...
 

hi, for notifications  I usually hit alt plus N 


Bill White <billwhite92701@...>
 

Well, this notification is in Firefox Options, and allows for typing in text to search for a particular option. Once it tells me that there’s a popup, I don’t know what to press to get the popup. I tried ALT plus N, and nothing. It’s not a Toast notification, so it won’t show up in Windows 10 notifications. If someone uses the latest Firefox, they might be able to duplicate this. Press ALT plus T, followed by O. It will say:

 

Mozilla Firefox
Horizontal
frame
Options Read Only
Find in Options Edit Has Popup

 

So, once it says:

 

Find in Options Edit Has Popup

 

What are we supposed to do to get the popup?

 

Thank you.

 

Bill White

 

billwhite92701@...

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of pmbeardy@...
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2018 5:27 AM
To: jfw@groups.io
Subject: keystrokes for pop-ups

 

hi, for notifications  I usually hit alt plus N 


 

Bill,

            Is there a specific page, which does not require user login, that you can share where this occurs?  I can play with it and see what I can determine.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back


 

Bill,

            It just hit me that you said this was in Firefox Options.  If you can tell me how you're navigating to where the problem occurs, and what you're searching for, that would be helpful.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back


pmbeardy@...
 

hi, sorry for that bad info . in IE alt plus N let's you pull up notifications. the old notification needs a response thingy.  

On Thu, 11 Oct 2018 10:06:25 -0700, "Bill White" wrote:

Well, this notification is in Firefox Options, and allows for typing in text to search for a particular option. Once it tells me that there’s a popup, I don’t know what to press to get the popup. I tried ALT plus N, and nothing. It’s not a Toast notification, so it won’t show up in Windows 10 notifications. If someone uses the latest Firefox, they might be able to duplicate this. Press ALT plus T, followed by O. It will say:

 

Mozilla Firefox
Horizontal
frame
Options Read Only
Find in Options Edit Has Popup

 

So, once it says:

 

Find in Options Edit Has Popup

 

What are we supposed to do to get the popup?

 

Thank you.

 

Bill White

 

billwhite92701@...

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of pmbeardy@...
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2018 5:27 AM
To: jfw@groups.io
Subject: keystrokes for pop-ups

 

hi, for notifications  I usually hit alt plus N 

 


Bill White <billwhite92701@...>
 

Hi, Brian. It’s not on a webpage. It’s in the options of Firefox.

 

ALT plus T, O.

 

Then there is an edit box which says:

 

Mozilla Firefox

Horizontal

frame

Options Read Only

Find in Options Edit Has Popup

 

Once I type in what to search for, I don’t know how to read the popup which is supposed to be there.

 

Bill White

 

billwhite92701@...

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2018 12:29 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: keystrokes for pop-ups

 

Bill,

            Is there a specific page, which does not require user login, that you can share where this occurs?  I can play with it and see what I can determine.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back


Bill White <billwhite92701@...>
 

Hi, Brian. I think I have discovered what the announcement in JAWS about a popup is. I went to Barnes and Noble, and it told me that the link for “My Account” has a popup. I didn’t know how to get the site to show me the options, so I called Customer Service. They told me that it is a link which requires hovering over the item with the mouse. I tried using the Left Mouse button on the NumPad, and it opened up the items under “My Account”. Just clicking on the link itself didn’t open the options. So I think that “Has a popup” means that it is a hover link.

 

Bill White

 

billwhite92701@...

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2018 12:33 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: keystrokes for pop-ups

 

Bill,

            It just hit me that you said this was in Firefox Options.  If you can tell me how you're navigating to where the problem occurs, and what you're searching for, that would be helpful.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back


 

What version of Firefox?   I'm on 62.0.3.

When I open Options, and I'm using NVDA right now, it just announces "Unknown" when I'm in the search box, which is where you land by default, and I can tab out of it to items on the page.  If I return to that edit box it announces it has auto complete.  When I try to look for a frame I get that there are none.

I really can't explain why JAWS would be reporting a "Pop up" and I'm imagining that this might be how "has auto complete" is being reported for some odd reason.  There is definitely no pop up.  As you type characters into that search box what is displayed keeps getting more and more limited based on what you've entered (provided there's a match).  For example, as I type the first five letters of "language" the display keeps changing until the only thing I have is language options.  I can tab out of the search box to the Choose Language button and the checkbox related to spell checking.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back


 

By the way, there is definitely not a mouse over action involved on the Firefox Options page.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back


Bill White <billwhite92701@...>
 

I’m on the same version as yourself. I’m using JAWS 2018, and when I go to General, in Options, it says,

 

Find an option, has popup.

 

Bill White

 

billwhite92701@...

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2018 8:11 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: keystrokes for pop-ups

 

What version of Firefox?   I'm on 62.0.3.

When I open Options, and I'm using NVDA right now, it just announces "Unknown" when I'm in the search box, which is where you land by default, and I can tab out of it to items on the page.  If I return to that edit box it announces it has auto complete.  When I try to look for a frame I get that there are none.

I really can't explain why JAWS would be reporting a "Pop up" and I'm imagining that this might be how "has auto complete" is being reported for some odd reason.  There is definitely no pop up.  As you type characters into that search box what is displayed keeps getting more and more limited based on what you've entered (provided there's a match).  For example, as I type the first five letters of "language" the display keeps changing until the only thing I have is language options.  I can tab out of the search box to the Choose Language button and the checkbox related to spell checking.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back


 

Bill,

          That is inaccurate based on any version/definition of "pop up" I've ever encountered.  This is something that might be worth pursuing with Vispero (formerly VFO, formerly Freedom Scientific).  I'd love to hear the explanation behind this.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back


Bill White <billwhite92701@...>
 

Hi, Brian. I called Vispero about the “Has popup message. Nikki at Vispero told me that “Has popup is synonymous with “Autocomplete” in NVDA. It used to say Autocomplete in JAWS as well, but some users told them that they didn’t like JAWS always saying Autocomplete, so they changed the verbiage to Has popup. It’s a situation where there’s an edit field, and as soon as some letters are typed in the edit field, suggestions appear below. She told me that by using the Virtual Cursor key (NumPad Plus twice, then arrowing down, the results of the popup or autocomplete can be viewed. In Firefox, these results may also be seen by Tabbing a few times.

 

When I explained that JAWS also says Has popup, in situations where a mouse hover is needed, she said that JAWS gets its information from the webpage, and that if the webpage sends information to JAWS that acts like an autocomplete, even though it’s a mouse hover, JAWS won’t know the difference, and will act as if it’s a situation where you would type in some letters, and suggestions would appear. This is what they mean by a popup.

 

Bill White

 

billwhite92701@...

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2018 9:34 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: keystrokes for pop-ups

 

Bill,

          That is inaccurate based on any version/definition of "pop up" I've ever encountered.  This is something that might be worth pursuing with Vispero (formerly VFO, formerly Freedom Scientific).  I'd love to hear the explanation behind this.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back


 

Bill,

           Thank you very much for having taken the time to report back about your conversation with Vispero.

           I also hope that they have taken on board that this description of "pop up" is very ill suited to the situation at hand.  I'd go for "fill-in options present" or something if autocomplete is considered too much (but if it is, my phrase would be, too).

           It also seems to me that a great many JAWS users never, ever bother to learn about or try the different verbosity options.  I've never quite understood why this is and I've worked with folks who have used JAWS for decades who have beginner verbosity, complain about the intrusiveness of it, and when I ask about whether they've ever tried the other settings I get a variant on, "You mean you can set JAWS to talk less?"   Most of my clients happen to be beginners who need beginner level verbosity, but I always mention that as they become more comfortable and more skilled they may want to ratchet JAWS verbosity back.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back


Maria Campbell
 

Personally, I don't think auto complete is too much.  Just saying.


Maria Campbell
lucky1inct@...

Success is having the courage to meet failure without being defeated.

On 10/12/2018 1:15 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:

Bill,

           Thank you very much for having taken the time to report back about your conversation with Vispero.

           I also hope that they have taken on board that this description of "pop up" is very ill suited to the situation at hand.  I'd go for "fill-in options present" or something if autocomplete is considered too much (but if it is, my phrase would be, too).

           It also seems to me that a great many JAWS users never, ever bother to learn about or try the different verbosity options.  I've never quite understood why this is and I've worked with folks who have used JAWS for decades who have beginner verbosity, complain about the intrusiveness of it, and when I ask about whether they've ever tried the other settings I get a variant on, "You mean you can set JAWS to talk less?"   Most of my clients happen to be beginners who need beginner level verbosity, but I always mention that as they become more comfortable and more skilled they may want to ratchet JAWS verbosity back.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back



 

Have yu tried the Jaws Mouseover keysroke, Jaws Key+Control+Enter? If you do that keystroke and you hear “change at line 23” where 23 is just a random number I picked as an example, then use “j”, the jump command” and type in 23 and press enter, then down arrow to see if the options are there.

 

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill White
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2018 7:47 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: keystrokes for pop-ups

 

Hi, Brian. I think I have discovered what the announcement in JAWS about a popup is. I went to Barnes and Noble, and it told me that the link for “My Account” has a popup. I didn’t know how to get the site to show me the options, so I called Customer Service. They told me that it is a link which requires hovering over the item with the mouse. I tried using the Left Mouse button on the NumPad, and it opened up the items under “My Account”. Just clicking on the link itself didn’t open the options. So I think that “Has a popup” means that it is a hover link.

 

Bill White

 

billwhite92701@...

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2018 12:33 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: keystrokes for pop-ups

 

Bill,

            It just hit me that you said this was in Firefox Options.  If you can tell me how you're navigating to where the problem occurs, and what you're searching for, that would be helpful.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back


 

Hi Bill,

 

I just tried this in FireFox > Options and if I type for, example, “privacy” and press enter it seems to put me in application mode, if you get out of it by pressing the PC cursor a couple of times and then simply down arrow you should find the options/search results. Yes, it says “privacy, has popup”, but I don’t think this really means much.

 

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill White
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2018 8:32 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: keystrokes for pop-ups

 

I’m on the same version as yourself. I’m using JAWS 2018, and when I go to General, in Options, it says,

 

Find an option, has popup.

 

Bill White

 

billwhite92701@...

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2018 8:11 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: keystrokes for pop-ups

 

What version of Firefox?   I'm on 62.0.3.

When I open Options, and I'm using NVDA right now, it just announces "Unknown" when I'm in the search box, which is where you land by default, and I can tab out of it to items on the page.  If I return to that edit box it announces it has auto complete.  When I try to look for a frame I get that there are none.

I really can't explain why JAWS would be reporting a "Pop up" and I'm imagining that this might be how "has auto complete" is being reported for some odd reason.  There is definitely no pop up.  As you type characters into that search box what is displayed keeps getting more and more limited based on what you've entered (provided there's a match).  For example, as I type the first five letters of "language" the display keeps changing until the only thing I have is language options.  I can tab out of the search box to the Choose Language button and the checkbox related to spell checking.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back


Bill White <billwhite92701@...>
 

Hi, Sieghard. I did try that keystroke, and it does work. Fodusing on the element that requires a click, then using the Left Mouse JAWS click also works.

 

Bill White

 

billwhite92701@...

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of Sieghard Weitzel
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2018 9:15 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: keystrokes for pop-ups

 

Have yu tried the Jaws Mouseover keysroke, Jaws Key+Control+Enter? If you do that keystroke and you hear “change at line 23” where 23 is just a random number I picked as an example, then use “j”, the jump command” and type in 23 and press enter, then down arrow to see if the options are there.

 

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill White
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2018 7:47 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: keystrokes for pop-ups

 

Hi, Brian. I think I have discovered what the announcement in JAWS about a popup is. I went to Barnes and Noble, and it told me that the link for “My Account” has a popup. I didn’t know how to get the site to show me the options, so I called Customer Service. They told me that it is a link which requires hovering over the item with the mouse. I tried using the Left Mouse button on the NumPad, and it opened up the items under “My Account”. Just clicking on the link itself didn’t open the options. So I think that “Has a popup” means that it is a hover link.

 

Bill White

 

billwhite92701@...

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2018 12:33 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: keystrokes for pop-ups

 

Bill,

            It just hit me that you said this was in Firefox Options.  If you can tell me how you're navigating to where the problem occurs, and what you're searching for, that would be helpful.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.

          ~ Saul Bellow, To Jerusalem and Back