Date   

moderated Re: An accessible router

Gmail Jonas
 

 

The NETGEAR, Nighthawk R6400 is a nice one I use it and it’s good with

2.4 and 5 GHZ!

https://amzn.to/2Va3jse

And it’s about $ 100, with support for USB!

 

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of Jaffar Sidek
Sent: Tuesday, April 14, 2020 6:03 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: An accessible router

 

Hi.  Routers are accessible through their web interface.  Ask the technician who will help you set up your router to give you your router's web address.  The address might, for example, be 192.168.2.154, something like that.  Then you can access it as you would any web site and set up the router on your own if you need to.  Cheers!
On 4/15/2020 5:15 AM, Marty Hutchings wrote:


moderated Re: An accessible router

Jaffar Sidek
 

Hi.  Routers are accessible through their web interface.  Ask the technician who will help you set up your router to give you your router's web address.  The address might, for example, be 192.168.2.154, something like that.  Then you can access it as you would any web site and set up the router on your own if you need to.  Cheers!
On 4/15/2020 5:15 AM, Marty Hutchings wrote:


moderated Re: An accessible router

David Csercsics
 

If you get any recommendations, ping me as well. Mine hasn't bit the dust just yet, but I don't think it's receiving firmware updates, and for some reason, my wifi has gotten silly. I have an iPhone 8 that drops connections very frequently, and I have to reboot the router daily or it bogs down pretty quick. I'm not sure if the iphone is the problem or the router, because other devices work fine on the thing, but it's puzzling.


moderated An accessible router

Marty Hutchings
 

My WIFI router has bit the dust.  Does anyone have any recommendations for a router with an accessible interface with JAWS?


moderated Re: Keyboard Shortcut for Navigating Word Templates

 

Robbie,

            You're quite welcome.  And I don't know exactly what you tweaked on your end but that last reply was top-posted, as is the typical convention.  Thanks.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman


moderated Re: Keyboard Shortcut for Navigating Word Templates

Robbie Curtis
 

Hi Brian,


My apologies as I have just now seen the documents you provided. Thanks for your help in this matter.


Have a great day!

On 4/13/2020 9:50 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
Robbie,

           As I have previously mentioned, F11 will only work in an MS-Word form document that has no editing restriction imposed.  A well designed form should have editing restriction imposed to allow only filling out the form as its initial state.  The three templates I supplied are an example of that.
 
            If you have either the blank templates you're using, or links to same I'll be happy to take a look at them, but I am not going to even try to guess as to what the designer may or may not have done with regard to the design of that template or restricting editing.

            As an aside, I do not know why, but all of your replies are embedding your message immediately after a quotation of the message heading from my prior message and before the message body of my prior message.  This is very unusual since it has happened more than once.  Top-posting is generally the best way to respond unless you are making a point by point response or are maintaining a line from a previous message for context.  Neither seems to have been the case here.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman

-- 
Robbie J. Curtis
essence64@...
"Stay in peace, not pieces!"

Virus-free. www.avg.com


moderated Re: Walmart.com and Jaws

Marie <magpie.mn@...>
 

Truer words were never spoken. The Find command in Jaws has been my go-to option so many, many times.
 
Marie
 

From: Brian Vogel
Sent: Monday, April 13, 2020 9:43 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Walmart.com and Jaws
 
On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 12:36 AM, Glenn / Lenny wrote:
Back in the early days, JFW did not have anything other than the find command and tabbing.
I came on the scene with either JAWS 9 or 10, so I'm not going back to the very earliest days in my comments.  I'm pretty much within the last decade, give or take a year or two.

But the find command is the screen reader users best friend!
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman


moderated Re: Walmart.com and Jaws

Pat Byrne
 

Brian,
Well stated. Thanks.
Pat ByrneAt 11:30 PM 4/13/2020, you wrote:

On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 12:04 AM, Glenn / Lenny wrote:
What a sighted person sees has little to do with what we access.

That is a very, very ill-informed statement. And this is coming from a fully sighted person who has very often found that "the answer" relies on what I see rather than trying to struggle with a screen reader for hours.Any screen reader user, by definition, suffers from a degree of "information blackout." You cannot see the screen itself, and as you pointed out, how the screen reader traverses a screen has to do with how it is designed in HTML, which is often hugely convoluted compared to what someone who can see sees can take in within a second of the screen coming up. For some particularly badly coded pages, what is front and center visually (which, after all, is what the main media of a webpage is) is buried in some convoluted HTML, coupled with less than stellar labeling at times, making it a chore to find with a screen reader if you don't already know it's there.Sighted people are seeing everything you can likely ever want to access. What they don't know is exactly how you go about that (with some rare exceptions, and I count myself among those). That's up to you, but if someone who sees tells you that such and such a thing is visible on the screen, you can likely find it much more quickly simply because you've had confirmation it's there and you should know how to seek it out with a screen reader.And the fact that someone sighted tells you how the page is laid out visually really doesn't matter, as you know that how it's laid out visually can be at huge variance with how the elements are arranged for traversal via screen reader. But you know they're there without having to plow through who knows how much detritus to find them, if you ever do. And that's not an insult to screen reader users, it's just a fact that some web page designs that are great for their primary demographic, the sighted, are very, very crappy for screen reader users even if every blessed thing on the page is accessible. I often am shocked at how a screen reader traverses elements in a page, and that's not the fault of the screen reader, but of the page designer. --

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363 Â

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

       ~ Joshua Liebman


moderated Re: Using Microsoft Teams with JAWS + additional questions

Ekstrand, Pamela A. -ND
 

From what I understand, Teams is Microsoft's replacement for Skype for Business.

My company also uses Slack heavily. I am managing with it, but am still not very proficient with certain aspects of it.

Pam


________________________________________
From: main@jfw.groups.io [main@jfw.groups.io] on behalf of Van Lant, Robin via groups.io [Robin_Van_Lant=Key.com@groups.io]
Sent: Monday, April 13, 2020 6:52 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Using Microsoft Teams with JAWS + additional questions

1. Zoom is a web conference application for meetings. The company is Zoom.
2. Teams is a Microsoft application for collaboration. I know it’s used within organizations for meetings and also general collaboration for ongoing projects. I suspect it’s Microsoft’s version of Zoom, with additional features, but I’m not fully sure.
3. Google offers Hangouts, which allows for video meetings. I just started using this and it seems more like a way to have a conversation with multiple people. I don’t think of it as a tool businesses would use to present a slideshow, but I’m still new. Maybe the Meet.Google.com thing you are talking about is more for that. Hangouts and the link you shared are both associated with Google, not Microsoft or Zoom. When I go to the link you sent, it appears that Google Meet is Google’s version of Zoom. I haven’t seen any talk on this list about this particular Google product, but others definitely talk about Google docs, Chrome, Hangouts and such, so I’m optimistic that Google Meet would be accessible. If you run into trouble with it and if you have a smart phone, get the Be My Eyes app and, from within that app, you can get a direct link to someone in Google Accessibility for help getting oriented to the new tool.

We all empathize. This is a crazy learning curve we are all on to adjust to working remotely.
Robin


Teams is Microsoft’s collaboration program.

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Marilyn Bland
Sent: Friday, April 10, 2020 9:36 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Using Microsoft Teams with JAWS + additional questions

Good morning all,

I’m feeling overwhelmed by all the on-line things that are now being used. My employer is using Meet.google.com for meetings and collaboration. I know this is different from Zoom, but is it also different fromTeams? Are there others on the list using Google Meets? Is Hangouts the same as any of these? Please clarify and give me some good places to learn how to use Google Meets.

Many thanks.

Marilyn


From: main@jfw.groups.io<mailto:main@jfw.groups.io> [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of Delaunay Christophe
Sent: Friday, April 10, 2020 9:50 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io<mailto:main@jfw.groups.io>
Subject: Re: Using Microsoft Teams with JAWS

Hi Sameer,

I’m hardly using Teams for three weeks now on a laptop running Windows 10 with jaws 2020 latest update because this is my employer’s recommended tool for remote working.

This app is globally accessible except for defining a “contact group” in the “Chat” tab, “Contacts” subtab.

In order to learn how to use it, I started from this web page:

https://support.office.com/en-us/article/basic-tasks-using-a-screen-reader-with-microsoft-teams-538a8741-f21b-4b04-b575-9df70ed4105d#picktab=windows<https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Furldefense.proofpoint.com%2Fv2%2Furl%3Fu%3Dhttps-3A__support.office.com_en-2Dus_article_basic-2Dtasks-2Dusing-2Da-2Dscreen-2Dreader-2Dwith-2Dmicrosoft-2Dteams-2D538a8741-2Df21b-2D4b04-2Db575-2D9df70ed4105d-23picktab-3Dwindows%26d%3DDwMFAg%26c%3DY1KkN7JyAPjrAJTUCirS0fy9vQY8xn4_Oh4EEEpbXx4%26r%3D-1nxI1tr9hKnIWNyLOCPlqI9Rh0Aj118fOCkSudZWTI%26m%3Dg2qs2t4I90ztiVuGTfRIcQsY0EMrH2VW2m-XR-Vx-CE%26s%3DV7WFbsHNZddVW3IZYBx75FcWXvXxEPxRimvJnOFZeHg%26e%3D&;data=02%7C01%7Cpamela.a.ekstrand.-nd%40disney.com%7Ca60bf2f99f0f4fef89a308d7dffd5f7f%7C56b731a8a2ac4c32bf6b616810e913c6%7C1%7C0%7C637224151640734768&sdata=VRbVGPWwOyQZxlA8php6TNsv1cJrB7d1hs9lvg8p0ME%3D&reserved=0>

I did not install any Jaws script yet but if there are some, I’d also like to know.

Hope this helps. Have a nice day. Chris D

From: main@jfw.groups.io<mailto:main@jfw.groups.io> <main@jfw.groups.io<mailto:main@jfw.groups.io>> On Behalf Of Sameer via groups.io
Sent: Friday, April 10, 2020 4:36 PM
To: JFW Group <main@jfw.groups.io<mailto:main@jfw.groups.io>>
Subject: Using Microsoft Teams with JAWS

Dear List Friends,

Is Microsoft Teams accessible with JAWS or do we need to install additional JAWS scrips to make it accessible? If we need to install additional JAWS scrips, kindly inform me where I can get these scrips.

Also, request you to kindly point me to a source for keystrokes to be used with Microsoft Teams. I am using the latest version of JAWS 2020 on a Windows 10 machine.

Thanking all in advance for any & all assistance.

Regards
Mr. Sameer Latey
Mumbai, India
This communication may contain privileged and/or confidential information. It is intended solely for the use of the addressee. If you are not the intended recipient, you are strictly prohibited from disclosing, copying, distributing or using any of this information. If you received this communication in error, please contact the sender immediately and destroy the material in its entirety, whether electronic or hard copy. This communication may contain nonpublic personal information about consumers subject to the restrictions of the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act. You may not directly or indirectly reuse or redisclose such information for any purpose other than to provide the services for which you are receiving the information.

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moderated Re: I have a question about a combination headset/microphone adaptor to use with JAWS

Gmail Jonas
 

Two good ones!

I like the Logitech ones this one is bluetooth.

https://amzn.to/2xuQKyz

USB, I like the mute button!

https://amzn.to/2K0RoGO

 

If not you can try a cell phone headset!

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of Kevin Minor
Sent: Sunday, April 12, 2020 5:58 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: I have a question about a combination headset/microphone adaptor to use with JAWS

 

Hi.

 

A month ago I got an Asus laptop. I put JAWS on it, and it works excellently. However, I have a question about it.

 

First, I’m not sure where to put this note, which group should have it, but I figure there would be those who know.  This computer doesn’t have a dedicated mic jack. Here’s question 1. Is there a way to learn if this PC has a combination headphone/microphone connector, and if it does, is there a splitter I can get where I could plug in headphones in one plug and a mic in the other?

 

Those are my questions. I’d appreciate any help, or steer me to a good list to ask my question.

 

Thanks.

 

Kevin, Jilly and Valerie


moderated Re: Using iTunes with JAWS

Ashleigh Piccinino
 

If you press CTRL and 5 on the number row—right above your main keyboard, you’ll be on your books part of iTunes. Think of these areas as tabs, but you should already be in the area where you can select the book of your choice. If you’re not, you get there by tabbing/I think it’s in a table or something. I also think you can press the applications key—shift F10 if not available with the apps key. Then, just arrow up/down to get to play. You can also do this with tab too, I believe/worked when I used that iTunes area. Remember that your “text-based” books don’t appear in books/have to download those from the iTunes Store itself, I thibnk.
Ashleigh Piccinino


On Apr 13, 2020, at 12:24 PM, Gezim Rexha <gezim_rexha@...> wrote:



Thank you very much. Excuse my ignorance, but could you please instruct me how I can find and listen a particular audio book if downloaded?

 

Best regards,

Gezim

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Ashleigh Piccinino
Sent: Saturday, April 11, 2020 4:50 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Using iTunes with JAWS

 

You might already be doing this, but F6 moves you between panes, so say you’re in your table of values, like music and things. You can move to another pane, like who the artest and stuff is by pressing F6. If you press it repeatedly, you’re back in the table, and tab also works for this. Yet, with tab, you have to listen to JAWS say things like your volume, iTunes store, and a whole bunch of other checkboxes. CTRL will be your best friend if you wan to go to podcasts, movies, and/or books. Note that audiobooks is the only thing available in the books section, something like CTRL and 5 on the numer row. CTRL 4 gets you to youyr pocasts, 3 with CTRL gets you to TV shows, I think, and for movies, CTRL an 2.



On Apr 1, 2020, at 2:11 PM, Gezim Rexha <gezim_rexha@...> wrote:



Hi all,

 

I would appreciate some instructions on using iTunes with JAWS. I am using JAWS 2019 and the latest iTunes Version.

 

Thank you in advance,

Gezim

 


moderated Re: Walmart.com and Jaws

Richard
 

I was using Internet Explorer, and either use the letter H to move through
the headings,
or use the Jaws find to search for specific words.
I also used the search field on the site to look for specific items.
I'll have to go back and see exactly how I did certain things since I forgot
after I left the site. lol

Rick

----- Original Message -----
From: "NCBootman" <ncbootman@gmail.com>
To: <main@jfw.groups.io>
Sent: Monday, April 13, 2020 12:07 PM
Subject: Re: Walmart.com and Jaws


Rick,

What browser did you use? How did you get to a list of categories of food
instead of those apparently random slides?


-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Richard
Sent: Monday, April 13, 2020 6:29 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Walmart.com and Jaws

I didn't have much trouble with the site, in fact, I did place an order.
You just have to spend some time getting familiar with the site like any
other.

Rick
----- Original Message -----
From: "NCBootman" <ncbootman@gmail.com>
To: <main@jfw.groups.io>
Sent: Sunday, April 12, 2020 12:13 AM
Subject: Walmart.com and Jaws


I want to explore the possibility of ordering groceries from Walmart.com. I
have the latest version of Jaws and a sighted friend says it doesn't look
doable with a screen reader to them. Is anyone using the regular part of
Walmart.com or the grocery.walmart.com section with positive results? When I
tried to navigate the sight, there did not seem to be any rhyme or reason
to things but I'm told visually it is laid out very clearly. Also, when I
tried to search Google for any tips, I got nowhere.



NCBootMan


moderated Re: Accessible bathroom scale

mcLeod stinnett
 

--
from, mack Marilyn, my apologies. can't seem to get that link to copy rite. just go to amazon and search for, taylor talking scale. you may have to arrow down a bit to find the one for $29.96


moderated Re: Accessible bathroom scale

mcLeod stinnett
 

--
from, mack Marilyn, try this scale from amazon for $30. I have it and like it very much. you don't have to activate it and wait for a ready prompt, just step on it.
https://www.amazon.com/Taylor-Precision-Products-Glass-
Digital/dp/B01FNXLA4I/ref=mp_s_a_1_7?dchild=1&keywords=taylor+talking+scale&qid=1586849862&sr=8-7


moderated Re: Walmart.com and Jaws

 

On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 12:36 AM, Glenn / Lenny wrote:
Back in the early days, JFW did not have anything other than the find command and tabbing.
I came on the scene with either JAWS 9 or 10, so I'm not going back to the very earliest days in my comments.  I'm pretty much within the last decade, give or take a year or two.

But the find command is the screen reader users best friend!
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman


moderated Re: Walmart.com and Jaws

 

On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 12:33 AM, Glenn / Lenny wrote:
Yeah, I have had sighted people watching the screen while I am going down the page, and they have told me that the highlighted items are jumping all over the screen, yet to me, I am just going down the page.
Trust me, that's one of the most frustrating experiences those of us who can see have when trying to work with individuals using screen readers.  And it's not the fault of those individuals.  I have never yet figured out any rhyme or reason to traversal order on most webpages via screen reader.  Focus flows nothing like it "should" to those of us who see.  And, believe me, very often what you think of as "just going down the page" is, in actuality, anything but, which is making your life that much harder whether you know it or not, and through no fault of your own.

I cannot tell you how thankful I was when I discovered the NVDA add-on Focus Highlight, which shows not only where the screen reader is but what state it's in for the object on which it has focus.  I can't remember what JAWS calls it at the moment, as I haven't tutored JAWS for the last year, but I know that the same thing has been added to JAWS.

And I'd tell any screen reader user who's engaging sighted help to please, please turn that feature on when you're working with a sighted helper.  Otherwise we have no freakin' idea where a screen reader has jumped to in many instances, particularly since when it's off there's no effort to keep scrolling on the visible webpage in sync with where the screen reader has landed.  When that's somewhere that's literally off-screen unless those add-ons/features are enabled, it's a nightmare for your assistant.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman


moderated Re: Keyboard Shortcut for Navigating Word Templates

Zel Iscel
 

Thanks Brian, that’s good to know.

 

Just FYI: I’ve just played with some forms I created and found that while using F11 and shift F11 navigates from one form field to another and allows you to write in edit boxes in an unprotected form, it doesn’t allow you to tick checkboxes.

 

Cheers

Zel

image001.jpg

 

Zel Iscel

Disability Specialist

Inclusive World

Mobile: 0413813885

Email: zel@...

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Tuesday, 14 April 2020 7:51 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Keyboard Shortcut for Navigating Word Templates

 

Robbie,

           By the way, and I just tried it, if someone has created an MS-Word fillable form template, and has NOT restricted editing, you can jump from form field to form field using F11 to move forward and SHIFT+F11 to move backward.  A good form template should have editing restricted to filling in the form only as the initial state.  If editing of the text that's a part of the form itself, rather than a fillable field, one can do so using these instructions.  (Note:  Anyone who intends to be creating or using Microsoft Word Fillable Forms needs to add the Developer Tab to MS-Word and keep it there.  Several of the commands below rely on having access to commands in the Developer Tab, which is not visible, nor accessible, in Word's default state).

Unprotecting All Word Form Fields and Converting Them to Regular Text

1.       You must first remove the restricted editing settings that allow you only to fill out the form

a.       Activate the Developer Tab, Restrict Editing.  ALT+L,PE

b.       Activate the Stop Protection button, which is the only button.  Just Hit Enter

c.       Close the Restrict Editing pane.  CTRL+Spacebar,C

2.       Select all content in the document.  CTRL+A

3.       Issue the command to convert all form fields to regular Word text.  CTRL+SHIFT+F9

At this point all form fields will be straight text like the rest of the document, and can be edited just as you usually would.  You cannot reverse this action, so be certain you have filled out anything that needs to have been filled out before going through the above steps.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman


moderated Re: Walmart.com and Jaws

Glenn / Lenny
 


Back in the early days, JFW did not have anything other than the find command and tabbing.
There was no quick keys at that time.
Then came the links list, that helped a lot.
Glenn

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, April 13, 2020 11:34 PM
Subject: Re: Walmart.com and Jaws

On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 12:15 AM, Glenn / Lenny wrote:
I know some folks still want to use pages like we did when we first started getting on-line, by tabbing to things.
Which has never been the most effective way, even way back when.  If you suspect you know something about the content on a page using the screen reader search function is one of the most efficient ways to confirm it exists or doesn't.  Also using things like headings lists, links lists, etc., as a "first cruise through" on an unfamiliar page will cut out tons of frustration that comes from brute force tabbing.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman


moderated Re: Walmart.com and Jaws

 

On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 12:15 AM, Glenn / Lenny wrote:
I know some folks still want to use pages like we did when we first started getting on-line, by tabbing to things.
Which has never been the most effective way, even way back when.  If you suspect you know something about the content on a page using the screen reader search function is one of the most efficient ways to confirm it exists or doesn't.  Also using things like headings lists, links lists, etc., as a "first cruise through" on an unfamiliar page will cut out tons of frustration that comes from brute force tabbing.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman


moderated Re: Walmart.com and Jaws

Glenn / Lenny
 


Yeah, I have had sighted people watching the screen while I am going down the page, and they have told me that the highlighted items are jumping all over the screen, yet to me, I am just going down the page.
Glenn

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, April 13, 2020 11:30 PM
Subject: Re: Walmart.com and Jaws

On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 12:04 AM, Glenn / Lenny wrote:
What a sighted person sees has little to do with what we access.
That is a very, very ill-informed statement.  And this is coming from a fully sighted person who has very often found that "the answer" relies on what I see rather than trying to struggle with a screen reader for hours.

Any screen reader user, by definition, suffers from a degree of "information blackout."  You cannot see the screen itself, and as you pointed out, how the screen reader traverses a screen has to do with how it is designed in HTML, which is often hugely convoluted compared to what someone who can see sees can take in within a second of the screen coming up.  For some particularly badly coded pages, what is front and center visually (which, after all, is what the main media of a webpage is) is buried in some convoluted HTML, coupled with less than stellar labeling at times, making it a chore to find with a screen reader if you don't already know it's there.

Sighted people are seeing everything you can likely ever want to access.  What they don't know is exactly how you go about that (with some rare exceptions, and I count myself among those).  That's up to you, but if someone who sees tells you that such and such a thing is visible on the screen, you can likely find it much more quickly simply because you've had confirmation it's there and you should know how to seek it out with a screen reader.

And the fact that someone sighted tells you how the page is laid out visually really doesn't matter, as you know that how it's laid out visually can be at huge variance with how the elements are arranged for traversal via screen reader.  But you know they're there without having to plow through who knows how much detritus to find them, if you ever do.  And that's not an insult to screen reader users, it's just a fact that some web page designs that are great for their primary demographic, the sighted, are very, very crappy for screen reader users even if every blessed thing on the page is accessible.  I often am shocked at how a screen reader traverses elements in a page, and that's not the fault of the screen reader, but of the page designer.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman

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