Date   
Re: re arranging columns in thunderbird

 

On Wed, Mar 11, 2020 at 01:26 PM, Robert Cole wrote:
But no matter what I did, even after having a sighted person drag the colum for me, Thunder Bird 68 will not say Unread for new emails.
Works fine for me, just a data point.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman

Re: re arranging columns in thunderbird

Robert Cole
 

Hi,

I was able to arange colums with the NVDA Add-On for Thunder Bird 60.9.1

But no matter what I did, even after having a sighted person drag the colum for me, Thunder Bird 68 will not say Unread for new emails.

So I whent back to the previous version.

On 3/11/2020 11:16 AM, Mario wrote:
Leo, when I setup TB for the first time, I was a bit annoyed that there isn't a simple way to do this thru TB (I believe there is, but no one discovered how to yet), so I used an addon for NVDA that simplifies rearranging the order of column headers. so if you have NVDA, install the addon (the one for Mozilla enhancements) and issue the keystroke to rearrange the columns the way you like.

I know you are using JAWS, but I think it is better to make the change via TB because the change will be there as opposed to being screen reader dependant.

-------- Original Message --------
From: Leo [mailto:literophilus@...]
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Date: Wednesday, March 11, 2020, 9:21 AM
Subject: re arranging columns in thunderbird
Hi everyone,

I want to have jaws telling me the correspondent  info, ((the sender),
before everything else.

Time back, I did it using  the customize list view, but now I find it
rather confusing,because I can't figure  out

the location of the columns in the dialogue box that pops up when I  go
through all the options of customize list view.

In previous versions of jaws, the columns were listed, so all I had to
do was to select a column and tab to find the options to move up or move
down, according to what I wanted.

can this be done now?

I'm using jaws 2020 and latest thundderbird.

--

--
Best,
    Leo




Re: Question regarding searching:

 

You'll get no argument from me with regard to the typing plus autocomplete crosstalk going on being distracting.   Hence the reason when I know that someone wants as close to silence (you probably do want words to be announced as you complete them) as you can get and a search is complex to formulate your search criteria either in a text editor or word processor, then copy and paste.

Everyone has their own preferences, which is fine, but when it comes to turning off autocomplete that has certain ramifications that may not have been considered.  Sometimes using workarounds turns out to be preferable, sometimes not.  Just laying out some options, as are you.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman

Re: Question regarding searching:

Glenn / Lenny
 


It is convenient, I agree, but it is sometimes distracting to hear it while listening to what you type, and if you are thinking of the search terms as well.
Glenn

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, March 11, 2020 11:52 AM
Subject: Re: Question regarding searching:

On Wed, Mar 11, 2020 at 12:46 PM, Glenn / Lenny wrote:
Use inline AutoComplete in the Internet Explorer Address
And if the issue is autocomplete in the address box, then actually navigating to your preferred search engine's own webpage, and entering the information in the search box presented, is another thing to try.

For myself, I would never want autocomplete off in the address box, as it's so darned convenient.  I generally avoid using the address box as a search box, but not always.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman

Re: Question regarding searching:

 

On Wed, Mar 11, 2020 at 12:46 PM, Glenn / Lenny wrote:
Use inline AutoComplete in the Internet Explorer Address
And if the issue is autocomplete in the address box, then actually navigating to your preferred search engine's own webpage, and entering the information in the search box presented, is another thing to try.

For myself, I would never want autocomplete off in the address box, as it's so darned convenient.  I generally avoid using the address box as a search box, but not always.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman

Re: Question regarding searching:

Glenn / Lenny
 

I think this is the answer to the original question:
In-line auto complete needs to be unchecked in advanced settings.
Do alt T and up arrow to options and enter, and control tab to the advanced page.
When there tab twice to the list of settings.
You will arrow to:
Use inline AutoComplete in the Internet Explorer Address
and uncheck it with the space bar if it says "on".
Here's the entire list of items:
Internet Options
AdvancedGeneral Security Privacy Content Connections Programs
Settings
Enable FTP folder view (outside of Internet Explorer)-ON
Enable Suggested Sites-OFF
Enable third-party browser extensions-ON*
Enable visual styles on buttons and controls in webpages-
Go to an intranet site for a single word entry in the Addre
Load sites and content in the background to optimize perf
Notify when downloads complete-OFF
Show friendly HTTP error messages-ON
Underline links
Always-ON
Hover-OFF
Never-OFF
Use inline AutoComplete in File Explorer and Run Dialog-O
Use inline AutoComplete in the Internet Explorer Address
*Takes effect after you restart your computer
Restore advanced settings
Reset Internet Explorer settings
Resets Internet Explorer's settings to their default  Reset...condition.
You should only use this if your browser is in an unusable state.
OK Cancel Apply

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, March 11, 2020 10:07 AM
Subject: Re: Question regarding searching:

I wonder if the issue is specific to the browser and search engine being used. The reason I stayed this is because I have never run into this issue, however I do not use ie 11.

Can a test be done using either Google chrome or Firefox and then going to www.google.com

And then see if the issue persists.

If you do not have fire fox or Google Chrome installed, just do a search for the downlights site and then install.

Thanks,abraham 

On Mar 11,e 2020, at 4:59 AM, Angel <angel238@...> wrote:

I employ IE 11, I think, as my browser.  When I search for something on the internet:  Jaws reads a continuous list of choices, as I am writing my search term

  Which is most annoying.  I should like Jaws to remain silent.  As I am typing the search term.  That I might not be distracted.  While writing my search terms.  How can I cause Jaws not to speak.  While attempting to write search terms?

Sent from Mail for Windows 10


Virus-free. www.avast.com

Re: presence unknown in Outlook 2016

 

ALT+H,CV   Home Ribbon, Current View Group.   I'd imagine the name of the current view will be announced, as NVDA announces it's in a list and that list view is selected.  There are, of course, other views in that list that could be selected, and if he's got another in use, that's what will be announced.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman

Re: presence unknown in Outlook 2016

Mario
 

how does he check what view he's using? I need the keystrokes to direct me to help him. I know the names are in ascending order by first name last name.

-------- Original Message --------
From: Brian Vogel [mailto:@britechguy]
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Date: Wednesday, March 11, 2020, 12:02 PM
Subject: presence unknown in Outlook 2016
Mario,

          Just managed to get back to looking at Contacts in Outlook
2016.  What View is she using?

I use list view by default, but even if I go to create another view from
scratch the default sort initially is by File As, Ascending, and for
individuals the File As is last name first.

--

Brian *-*Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363

*/Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's
beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting
them./*

        ~ Joshua Liebman

Re: Searching the JAWS Group Archive

 

Step-by-step instructions, in MS-Word format, downloadable from:  Searching the JAWS Group Archive

 

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman

Searching the JAWS Group Archive

 

Since I mentioned this earlier this morning, I decided to modify one of my other tutorials to be specific to the JAWS group.  So, when you "know in your bones" that a question you're about to ask is very likely to have been asked and answered, possibly multiple times, consider taking a cruise through the group archive before asking it again.
----------------------------------------------

Searching the Group Archive

Option 1 – Using the Groups.io Archive Search Page

1.        Navigate to the archive search page:  https://jfw.groups.io/g/main/search

2.      Enter your search terms in the Search edit box:  [term1 term2 term3] without the square brackets, as an example.

3.       Activate the Search button.

4.      Results will be returned as a list of messages.  If you prefer to have it presented as a list of topics, then:

a.      Activate the Tools button.

b.      Check the Collapse Topics checkbox.  You’re probably done, but for additional options see step 4c, otherwise, go to step 5.

c.       If you so desire there are additional options, a dropdown that allows you to limit the date range for the messages, which defaults to Any Time, a checkbox for Exclude signatures, which will omit signature text from the search, and a Clear button, which will set all of the previously mentioned additional options back to their defaults:  Any time and both checkboxes unchecked.

5.      Use your screen reader’s option for showing a list of links.  Find the next page link in that list, then what immediately follows that is a list of messages (or topics) each of which will be immediately followed by the link to the member profile of the member that wrote the message or initiated the topic.  Down arrowing through allows you to review the results you’re actually interested in very quickly.  The key is getting yourself to that next page link before starting to down arrow.

6.      Once you open a message or topic, the easiest way to get past all of the navigation controls is to open a list of headings (or use the H single letter navigation to get there).

 

Option 2 – Using the web search engine of your choosing

1.        Navigate to the page of the search engine of your choosing, e.g., Google, DuckDuckGo, Yahoo, etc.

2.      In the edit box for your search terms, put in the keywords (or quote enclosed phrases) you’re looking for first.  Immediately follow those with exactly this, site:jfw.groups.io/g/main/    That tells the search engine to limit itself to searching the site that immediately follows the site: operator (no space after that colon).  Run the search.  You can also, if you prefer, put the site: information as the first search term; it doesn’t matter if it’s at the beginning, in the middle, or at the end, just that it’s present.

3.       Use your screen reader’s option for showing a list of headings, as all web search engines I have used return the individual web pages returned as a list of headings.  Review those headings to review what’s been returned.  You can also use the single letter navigation command for headings (typically H) to jump from heading to heading [result to result].

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman

Re: presence unknown in Outlook 2016

 

Mario,

          Just managed to get back to looking at Contacts in Outlook 2016.  What View is she using? 

I use list view by default, but even if I go to create another view from scratch the default sort initially is by File As, Ascending, and for individuals the File As is last name first.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman

Re: presence unknown in Outlook 2016

Mario
 

oh drat, my friend said this mourning, the issue of presence unknown in the contact list is back. I'll see if the scaling is still at 100%.

I wonder if there's a specific setting in Outlook 2016 that handles this. in the mean while, if anyone knows what to do about this.

-------- Original Message --------
From: Mario Brusco [mailto:mrb620@...]
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Date: Tuesday, March 10, 2020, 12:18 PM
Subject: presence unknown in Outlook 2016
hey Brian, my friend no longer has the presence unknown issue any more,
thanks to you. but he still has the issue regarding the names in his
contacts. they are sorted by first middle last name, but they don't
appear to be alphabetized in ascending order.

you mentioned how you do it but I don't get it, so I can direct him what
to do. can you expand on how you do it?

-------- Original Message --------
From: Mario [mailto:mrb620@...]
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Date: Tuesday, March 10, 2020, 11:35 AM
Subject: presence unknown in Outlook 2016
thanks Brian for the help.

so, if there is a setting to change the scaling and by doing so,
funkiness can occur, why is the setting there? I would imagine most
users would not expect funky things to happen by changing such an
obscure (and unnecessary?) setting.

-------- Original Message --------
From: Brian Vogel [mailto:@britechguy]
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Date: Tuesday, March 10, 2020, 11:17 AM
Subject: presence unknown in Outlook 2016
There is mixing of locations going on here.  The Settings, System,
Display Pane, Scale and Layout section is where this is found under
Windows 10 (or at least most easily and directly).  If you literally
cannot see the safest thing is to leave scaling at 100%, which is what's
recommended.

There can be all kinds of odd offshoots from having text scaled above
100%, though I have no idea if the "Presence Unknown" bit is one of them.

As to sorting contacts in Outlook 2016, it can be done in the same way
it always has been done.  I sort my contacts on the "File As" field
because I want them to sort in Last Name, First Name order.   Any column
can be selected and then an ascending or descending sort applied.

Re: re arranging columns in thunderbird

 

The tutorial I am remembering with regard to using screen reader drag and drop for Thunderbird column rearranging was written by Gene NZ (his online moniker) on his site accessibilitycentral.net, specifically the page:  http://accessibilitycentral.net/accessible%20email%20client%20mozilla%20thunderbird.html

The pertinent section:
-----------------------

Using drag and drop with NVDA to rearrange column headers in Mozilla Thunderbird

If you would like to move a column from one area to another in the email header, you will need to tab from tree view into your email message list. Next put NVDA into object navigation mode.  Use the NVDA key + the number 1 on the numeric keypad to do this.

If I wanted to move a particular column to another location (IE before or after the current column) I would do the following in the header of the email.

From the message list, I would press the NVDA key + the number 4 on the numeric keypad until I heard the name of the column I wanted to move (for example Status). I would then press NVDA + Numpad divide (above the number 8 on the numeric keypad) to route the mouse pointer there. Then you would press Shift + Numpad divide again to lock the left mouse button. Press the NVDA key + Numpad 4 again a number of times until you hear the name of the column immediately before the column I want to move the selected column to (for example next to unread). Press the NVDA key + Numpad divide to put the mouse pointer there, and press the Shift key + Numpad divide to unlock the left mouse button.

Please note: You can also use the NVDA key + the number 6 on the numeric keypad to move it back the other way then unlock it in that position.

Now, when you arrow down or up your messages, you will notice the difference when NVDA reads it out.


For an audio tutorial on how to insert and remove columns in Mozilla Thunderbird, as well as moving your column from one position to another using drag and drop with NVDA, please visit the following link

https://www.dropbox.com/s/2hxhyjwt1cwbrhm/adding%20or%20removing%20columns%20plus%20drag%20and%20dropping%20in%20mozilla%20thunderbird.MP3?dl=0
-------------------------------------

Even though it's written for NVDA the parallel concepts in JAWS for doing these steps apply.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman

Re: re arranging columns in thunderbird

 

Leo,

           I know that others have posted step-by-step instructions for doing this, so a search of the archives will turn that up.  I positively despise simulated drag and drop because I just never quite get it to work as I expect it will.

           If you have the option of getting sighted assistance, this rearranging can be done in a matter of seconds and seldom, if ever, needs to be done again if you have your columns ordered the way you want them when that rearranging is finished.  It can even be done via a remote session using something like Quick Assist (Win8 or Win10) or Teamviewer or JAWS Tandem similar if you have someone on the other end who can do the drag and drop, whether by sight or simulation using the screen reader.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman

Re: re arranging columns in thunderbird

Mario
 

Leo, when I setup TB for the first time, I was a bit annoyed that there isn't a simple way to do this thru TB (I believe there is, but no one discovered how to yet), so I used an addon for NVDA that simplifies rearranging the order of column headers. so if you have NVDA, install the addon (the one for Mozilla enhancements) and issue the keystroke to rearrange the columns the way you like.

I know you are using JAWS, but I think it is better to make the change via TB because the change will be there as opposed to being screen reader dependant.

-------- Original Message --------
From: Leo [mailto:literophilus@...]
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Date: Wednesday, March 11, 2020, 9:21 AM
Subject: re arranging columns in thunderbird
Hi everyone,

I want to have jaws telling me the correspondent  info, ((the sender),
before everything else.

Time back, I did it using  the customize list view, but now I find it
rather confusing,because I can't figure  out

the location of the columns in the dialogue box that pops up when I  go
through all the options of customize list view.

In previous versions of jaws, the columns were listed, so all I had to
do was to select a column and tab to find the options to move up or move
down, according to what I wanted.

can this be done now?

I'm using jaws 2020 and latest thundderbird.

--

--
Best,
Leo

Re: re arranging columns in thunderbird

Leo
 

Hi Brian,

I htought about trying to doing this using drag and drop, but to be honest, I never understood how to make it work,

first of all, I don't know how to reach the specific column. either using jaws cursor or using virtual cursor I can't figure out how to do it...


Best,
   Leo
On 3/11/2020 8:41 AM, Brian Vogel wrote:

The only way I've ever known to rearrange column order in Thunderbird is via drag and drop for the columns you've chosen to display.  This still works with JAWS simulated drag and drop, or at least it did the last time I had to do it that way.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman

Re: Question regarding searching:

Abraham Sweiss
 

I wonder if the issue is specific to the browser and search engine being used. The reason I stayed this is because I have never run into this issue, however I do not use ie 11.

Can a test be done using either Google chrome or Firefox and then going to www.google.com

And then see if the issue persists.

If you do not have fire fox or Google Chrome installed, just do a search for the downlights site and then install.

Thanks,abraham 

On Mar 11,e 2020, at 4:59 AM, Angel <angel238@...> wrote:

I employ IE 11, I think, as my browser.  When I search for something on the internet:  Jaws reads a continuous list of choices, as I am writing my search term

  Which is most annoying.  I should like Jaws to remain silent.  As I am typing the search term.  That I might not be distracted.  While writing my search terms.  How can I cause Jaws not to speak.  While attempting to write search terms?

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 


Virus-free. www.avast.com

Re: Question regarding searching:

 

If you're using IE you really do need to dump it, for starters.

Why You Should Dump Internet Explorer | Daniel Miessler        (Dec 2019)

The perils of using Internet Explorer as your default browser ...            (March 2019 – straight from the proverbial horse’s mouth)

Microsoft cybersecurity expert: Please, stop using Internet ...  (Feb 2019)

Microsoft security chief: IE is not a browser, so stop using ...     (Feb 2019)

Microsoft wants you to stop using Internet Explorer                    (Feb 2019)

12 reasons not to use Internet Explorer, ever | Computerworld  (June 2011 – Even more valid now)

And if you web search on “Why you should not use Internet Explorer” the list of returned results is long, and virtually unanimous in the expert (and non-expert) opinion that you should not.

Regardless of the browser you're using, if you want relative silence when trying to think through and compose your list of search criteria I'd suggest you do that step in Notepad, particularly for complex searches with many terms (often including the forced inclusion, +, and exclusion, -, operators).   After you've got it "perfected," or think you do, select all, copy, then paste into the search engine.  It also makes it easier to modify when you determine that what you thought was perfected is, in actuality, in need of more refinement.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman

Re: Question regarding searching:

Mario
 

first let us know exactly which browser you are using. if you're using JAWS, NVDA or probably what ever screen reader, press insert+t to hear the program you're using. telling us "I think" most likely won't elicit an appropriate response if someone knows the answer.

-------- Original Message --------
From: Angel [mailto:angel238@...]
To: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io>
Date: Wednesday, March 11, 2020, 4:59 AM
Subject: Question regarding searching:
I employ IE 11, I think, as my browser.  When I search for something on
the internet:  Jaws reads a continuous list of choices, as I am writing
my search term

  Which is most annoying.  I should like Jaws to remain silent.  As I
am typing the search term.  That I might not be distracted.  While
writing my search terms.  How can I cause Jaws not to speak.  While
attempting to write search terms?

Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
Windows 10


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Re: re arranging columns in thunderbird

 

The only way I've ever known to rearrange column order in Thunderbird is via drag and drop for the columns you've chosen to display.  This still works with JAWS simulated drag and drop, or at least it did the last time I had to do it that way.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

Tolerance is the positive and cordial effort to understand another's beliefs, practices, and habits without necessarily sharing or accepting them.

        ~ Joshua Liebman