Date   

moderated Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

 

On Tue, Aug 11, 2020 at 12:22 PM, Glenn / Lenny wrote:
It is only unsafe to the reckless user,
This is untrue.  As soon as security patches cease, any nefarious player that finds them can exploit them, and in perpetuity.

It's not "drinking the Kool-Aid" but best practice to advise any user against using any unsupported OS in contact with cyberspace.  And that's whether we're talking an unsupported Windows, Linux, MacOS, or what have you.

You do as you see fit.  I'm standing firmly with exactly what I've said and what I do.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

The purpose of education is not to validate ignorance but to overcome it.
       ~ Lawrence Krauss


moderated Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

Glenn / Lenny
 


Brian, are you being paid by Microsoft?
 

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2020 11:18 AM
Subject: Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

On Tue, Aug 11, 2020 at 12:13 PM, Dave Durber wrote:
Yes, I am being paid.
-
Well, since 8.1 is still supported, there are no liability issues with installing it.

I would still try to assess why they want it.  If it's because it's what they're used to from other machines, then so be it, but I'd still encourage them to give Windows 10 a try.

Virtually all the resistance I've met to Windows 10 over the years it's been available has been based entirely on misinformation about it (as well as ignorance of the fact that most of the things complained about, particularly system health telemetry, were retrofitted all the way back to Windows 7).
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

The purpose of education is not to validate ignorance but to overcome it.
       ~ Lawrence Krauss


moderated Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

Glenn / Lenny
 


Brian,
Microsoft has not totally given up on support for even windows 7 users.
In fact MS recently decided to include the Edge browser as a windows 7 update that I did not ask for.
At first, I did not like that MS did this, but when FireFox was crashing, I'm glad it was available as an option, I sometimes use Chrome too.
And Security Essentials is still working in 7.
And there are third-party virus and malware tools available for folks to use.
It is only unsafe to the reckless user, and we should not be trying to scare people into drinking the Microsoft kool aid with regard to windows 10.
The fact is that if someone is reckless regarding what they download and sites they go to, no matter which version of windows, they are vulnerable to malicious software getting on their system.
Glenn

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2020 11:11 AM
Subject: Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

On Tue, Aug 11, 2020 at 11:29 AM, Joseph Lee wrote:
This begs the question: did your friend tell you their reasons for not upgrading to Windows 10 for free?
-
That would be interesting to know.

But regardless of the reason, I have gotten pretty adamant with my clients about Windows 10 or nothing if the question of upgrading arises.  It is completely unsafe to use any unsupported OS in contact with the internet.  Windows 8.1, unless someone already uses it, has been much more difficult for most Windows users to adjust to because it made a tectonic shift in presumptions about how things would be accessed, skewing almost entirely toward touch, that simply never materialized.  It's also got its clock ticking.

I won't even consider installing Windows 7 under any circumstances or any other version of Windows prior to 8.1, as they're all out of support.

And the sooner people, all of 'em, get over the idea that, "I don't like it," being a legitimate reason to reject an operating system the better.  It is now, and always has been, for sane users, a choice among what is currently under support for the hardware they have.  Choosing otherwise is willful stupidity (and, as someone who does this for a living, also would potentially expose me to liability I refuse to be exposed to).

There are things about Windows 10 I don't like, there were many things about Windows 8/8.1 I despised, there were things about Windows 7 I didn't like - see the pattern?  But what you actually use is what Microsoft supports, not what you personally prefer.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

The purpose of education is not to validate ignorance but to overcome it.
       ~ Lawrence Krauss


moderated Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

 

On Tue, Aug 11, 2020 at 12:13 PM, Dave Durber wrote:
Yes, I am being paid.
-
Well, since 8.1 is still supported, there are no liability issues with installing it.

I would still try to assess why they want it.  If it's because it's what they're used to from other machines, then so be it, but I'd still encourage them to give Windows 10 a try.

Virtually all the resistance I've met to Windows 10 over the years it's been available has been based entirely on misinformation about it (as well as ignorance of the fact that most of the things complained about, particularly system health telemetry, were retrofitted all the way back to Windows 7).
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

The purpose of education is not to validate ignorance but to overcome it.
       ~ Lawrence Krauss


moderated Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

Dave Durber
 


Yes, I am being paid.
 
Dave
 

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, 11 August, 2020 4:24 PM
Subject: Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

There is no upgrade path from Windows 7 to Windows 8, and never has been.   It must be installed from scratch, and you must acquire a license key for it.

The only free upgrade path was from Windows 7, 8, or 8.1 to Windows 10.

Personally, unless they're paying you, I'd refuse to install Windows 8.1 at this point.  It makes absolutely no sense to do so.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

The purpose of education is not to validate ignorance but to overcome it.
       ~ Lawrence Krauss


moderated Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

Glenn / Lenny
 

You will need to use upgrade installation media, it may not work with a full install of 8.1.
Another option is to use Windows 10 winPE to install the 8.1.You will need to be sure to match the version in terms of 64 bit and 32 bit.
Glenn

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2020 11:09 AM
Subject: Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

Glen:
 
I have that. All the versions of windows which are included with that TWPE, are for Windows 7.
 
Dave
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, 11 August, 2020 4:40 PM
Subject: Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

No matter how you go about it, you can install windows 8 using WinPE, which uses NVDA, not Narrator.
You need to match the installer to the types of windows.
There are about half a dozen types of windows 7, and the mega.ISO of WinPE has the .WIM files for the various types of windows.
Glenn
Glenn
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2020 8:24 AM
Subject: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

For those on this list, who used Windows 8 or 8.1, I have the following questions:
 
Did you upgrade from Windows 7 to Windows 8 or 8.1. If you did, did the Windows  7 authorization  key, also authorize versions of Windows 8 or, did you need to purchase a new authorization key for versions of Windows 8;
 
If you had Windows 7 installed but, you decided to install a new installation of Windows 8 or 8.1, were you able to use the windows 7 key, to authorize versions of Windows 8.
 
Were you able to install Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself or, did you have visual assistance;
 
If you installed Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself, was Narrator available to you, to assist you through the installation process; and
 
If Narrator was not available, how didyou install Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself, without visual assistance.
 
I have suggested they upgrade to Windows 10 but, they are adament, they want Windows 8.
 
Dave
 
 


moderated Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

Dave Durber
 

I will tell them that.
 
Dave
 

----- Original Message -----
From: Chris Hill
Sent: Tuesday, 11 August, 2020 4:26 PM
Subject: Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

The right answer here is forget about it.  Last time I messed with reinstalling 8, I could never get it to upgrade to 8.1, which left it an insecure mess.  Sometimes you just have to say no, and this is one of those.



On 8/11/2020 08:24, Dave Durber wrote:
For those on this list, who used Windows 8 or 8.1, I have the following questions:
 
Did you upgrade from Windows 7 to Windows 8 or 8.1. If you did, did the Windows  7 authorization  key, also authorize versions of Windows 8 or, did you need to purchase a new authorization key for versions of Windows 8;
 
If you had Windows 7 installed but, you decided to install a new installation of Windows 8 or 8.1, were you able to use the windows 7 key, to authorize versions of Windows 8.
 
Were you able to install Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself or, did you have visual assistance;
 
If you installed Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself, was Narrator available to you, to assist you through the installation process; and
 
If Narrator was not available, how didyou install Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself, without visual assistance.
 
I have suggested they upgrade to Windows 10 but, they are adament, they want Windows 8.
 
Dave
 
 


moderated Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

 

On Tue, Aug 11, 2020 at 11:29 AM, Joseph Lee wrote:
This begs the question: did your friend tell you their reasons for not upgrading to Windows 10 for free?
-
That would be interesting to know.

But regardless of the reason, I have gotten pretty adamant with my clients about Windows 10 or nothing if the question of upgrading arises.  It is completely unsafe to use any unsupported OS in contact with the internet.  Windows 8.1, unless someone already uses it, has been much more difficult for most Windows users to adjust to because it made a tectonic shift in presumptions about how things would be accessed, skewing almost entirely toward touch, that simply never materialized.  It's also got its clock ticking.

I won't even consider installing Windows 7 under any circumstances or any other version of Windows prior to 8.1, as they're all out of support.

And the sooner people, all of 'em, get over the idea that, "I don't like it," being a legitimate reason to reject an operating system the better.  It is now, and always has been, for sane users, a choice among what is currently under support for the hardware they have.  Choosing otherwise is willful stupidity (and, as someone who does this for a living, also would potentially expose me to liability I refuse to be exposed to).

There are things about Windows 10 I don't like, there were many things about Windows 8/8.1 I despised, there were things about Windows 7 I didn't like - see the pattern?  But what you actually use is what Microsoft supports, not what you personally prefer.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

The purpose of education is not to validate ignorance but to overcome it.
       ~ Lawrence Krauss


moderated Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

Dave Durber
 


No they did not. I will call them later and ask them.
 
Dave

 
----- Original Message -----
From: Joseph Lee
Sent: Tuesday, 11 August, 2020 4:29 PM
Subject: Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

Hi,

Actually, one can upgrade from Windows 7 to 8/8.1 through an in-place upgrade unless the product key is for a different edition. I concur with Brian: Windows 8.1 support ends in 2023, and beyond that point, Windows 10 is the way to go. This begs the question: did your friend tell you their reasons for not upgrading to Windows 10 for free?

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2020 8:25 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

 

There is no upgrade path from Windows 7 to Windows 8, and never has been.   It must be installed from scratch, and you must acquire a license key for it.

The only free upgrade path was from Windows 7, 8, or 8.1 to Windows 10.

Personally, unless they're paying you, I'd refuse to install Windows 8.1 at this point.  It makes absolutely no sense to do so.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

The purpose of education is not to validate ignorance but to overcome it.
       ~ Lawrence Krauss


moderated Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

Dave Durber
 

Glen:
 
I have that. All the versions of windows which are included with that TWPE, are for Windows 7.
 
Dave
 

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, 11 August, 2020 4:40 PM
Subject: Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

No matter how you go about it, you can install windows 8 using WinPE, which uses NVDA, not Narrator.
You need to match the installer to the types of windows.
There are about half a dozen types of windows 7, and the mega.ISO of WinPE has the .WIM files for the various types of windows.
Glenn
Glenn
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2020 8:24 AM
Subject: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

For those on this list, who used Windows 8 or 8.1, I have the following questions:
 
Did you upgrade from Windows 7 to Windows 8 or 8.1. If you did, did the Windows  7 authorization  key, also authorize versions of Windows 8 or, did you need to purchase a new authorization key for versions of Windows 8;
 
If you had Windows 7 installed but, you decided to install a new installation of Windows 8 or 8.1, were you able to use the windows 7 key, to authorize versions of Windows 8.
 
Were you able to install Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself or, did you have visual assistance;
 
If you installed Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself, was Narrator available to you, to assist you through the installation process; and
 
If Narrator was not available, how didyou install Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself, without visual assistance.
 
I have suggested they upgrade to Windows 10 but, they are adament, they want Windows 8.
 
Dave
 
 


moderated Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

Glenn / Lenny
 


Well I would not want 10, and they may not either.
Glenn

----- Original Message -----
From: Joseph Lee
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2020 10:29 AM
Subject: Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

Hi,

Actually, one can upgrade from Windows 7 to 8/8.1 through an in-place upgrade unless the product key is for a different edition. I concur with Brian: Windows 8.1 support ends in 2023, and beyond that point, Windows 10 is the way to go. This begs the question: did your friend tell you their reasons for not upgrading to Windows 10 for free?

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2020 8:25 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

 

There is no upgrade path from Windows 7 to Windows 8, and never has been.   It must be installed from scratch, and you must acquire a license key for it.

The only free upgrade path was from Windows 7, 8, or 8.1 to Windows 10.

Personally, unless they're paying you, I'd refuse to install Windows 8.1 at this point.  It makes absolutely no sense to do so.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

The purpose of education is not to validate ignorance but to overcome it.
       ~ Lawrence Krauss


moderated Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

Glenn / Lenny
 

I suppose one could buy 8.1 on eBay and just use the new key.
That might cost around 25 dollars.
 
Glenn

----- Original Message -----
From: Chris Hill
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2020 10:26 AM
Subject: Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

The right answer here is forget about it.  Last time I messed with reinstalling 8, I could never get it to upgrade to 8.1, which left it an insecure mess.  Sometimes you just have to say no, and this is one of those.



On 8/11/2020 08:24, Dave Durber wrote:
For those on this list, who used Windows 8 or 8.1, I have the following questions:
 
Did you upgrade from Windows 7 to Windows 8 or 8.1. If you did, did the Windows  7 authorization  key, also authorize versions of Windows 8 or, did you need to purchase a new authorization key for versions of Windows 8;
 
If you had Windows 7 installed but, you decided to install a new installation of Windows 8 or 8.1, were you able to use the windows 7 key, to authorize versions of Windows 8.
 
Were you able to install Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself or, did you have visual assistance;
 
If you installed Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself, was Narrator available to you, to assist you through the installation process; and
 
If Narrator was not available, how didyou install Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself, without visual assistance.
 
I have suggested they upgrade to Windows 10 but, they are adament, they want Windows 8.
 
Dave
 
 


moderated Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

Glenn / Lenny
 

No matter how you go about it, you can install windows 8 using WinPE, which uses NVDA, not Narrator.
You need to match the installer to the types of windows.
There are about half a dozen types of windows 7, and the mega.ISO of WinPE has the .WIM files for the various types of windows.
Glenn
Glenn

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2020 8:24 AM
Subject: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

For those on this list, who used Windows 8 or 8.1, I have the following questions:
 
Did you upgrade from Windows 7 to Windows 8 or 8.1. If you did, did the Windows  7 authorization  key, also authorize versions of Windows 8 or, did you need to purchase a new authorization key for versions of Windows 8;
 
If you had Windows 7 installed but, you decided to install a new installation of Windows 8 or 8.1, were you able to use the windows 7 key, to authorize versions of Windows 8.
 
Were you able to install Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself or, did you have visual assistance;
 
If you installed Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself, was Narrator available to you, to assist you through the installation process; and
 
If Narrator was not available, how didyou install Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself, without visual assistance.
 
I have suggested they upgrade to Windows 10 but, they are adament, they want Windows 8.
 
Dave
 
 


moderated Re: jaws 2020 update?

Larry Gassman <larrygassman@...>
 

It should be this month.

Larry

 

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill White
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2020 8:34 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: jaws 2020 update?

 

I don't think anyone knows when the next JAWS update will be released. It will be when Vispero has enough bugs fixed to make it worth it to release an update, and when they are fairly sure the "fixes" work on a wide range of system configurations.

 

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of Leo
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2020 5:52 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: jaws 2020 update?

 

does anyone know when the next update will be release? the last update was released in June.

 

--
Best,
   Leo


moderated Re: jaws 2020 update?

Bill White <billwhite92701@...>
 

I don't think anyone knows when the next JAWS update will be released. It will be when Vispero has enough bugs fixed to make it worth it to release an update, and when they are fairly sure the "fixes" work on a wide range of system configurations.

 

Bill White

billwhite92701@...

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of Leo
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2020 5:52 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: jaws 2020 update?

 

does anyone know when the next update will be release? the last update was released in June.

 

--
Best,
   Leo


moderated Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

 

Hi,

Actually, one can upgrade from Windows 7 to 8/8.1 through an in-place upgrade unless the product key is for a different edition. I concur with Brian: Windows 8.1 support ends in 2023, and beyond that point, Windows 10 is the way to go. This begs the question: did your friend tell you their reasons for not upgrading to Windows 10 for free?

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2020 8:25 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

 

There is no upgrade path from Windows 7 to Windows 8, and never has been.   It must be installed from scratch, and you must acquire a license key for it.

The only free upgrade path was from Windows 7, 8, or 8.1 to Windows 10.

Personally, unless they're paying you, I'd refuse to install Windows 8.1 at this point.  It makes absolutely no sense to do so.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

The purpose of education is not to validate ignorance but to overcome it.
       ~ Lawrence Krauss


moderated Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

Chris Hill
 

The right answer here is forget about it.  Last time I messed with reinstalling 8, I could never get it to upgrade to 8.1, which left it an insecure mess.  Sometimes you just have to say no, and this is one of those.



On 8/11/2020 08:24, Dave Durber wrote:
For those on this list, who used Windows 8 or 8.1, I have the following questions:
 
Did you upgrade from Windows 7 to Windows 8 or 8.1. If you did, did the Windows  7 authorization  key, also authorize versions of Windows 8 or, did you need to purchase a new authorization key for versions of Windows 8;
 
If you had Windows 7 installed but, you decided to install a new installation of Windows 8 or 8.1, were you able to use the windows 7 key, to authorize versions of Windows 8.
 
Were you able to install Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself or, did you have visual assistance;
 
If you installed Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself, was Narrator available to you, to assist you through the installation process; and
 
If Narrator was not available, how didyou install Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself, without visual assistance.
 
I have suggested they upgrade to Windows 10 but, they are adament, they want Windows 8.
 
Dave
 
 


moderated Re: Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

 

There is no upgrade path from Windows 7 to Windows 8, and never has been.   It must be installed from scratch, and you must acquire a license key for it.

The only free upgrade path was from Windows 7, 8, or 8.1 to Windows 10.

Personally, unless they're paying you, I'd refuse to install Windows 8.1 at this point.  It makes absolutely no sense to do so.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 1909, Build 18363  

The purpose of education is not to validate ignorance but to overcome it.
       ~ Lawrence Krauss


moderated Question regarding installing a new installation of Windows 8/8.1

Dave Durber
 

For those on this list, who used Windows 8 or 8.1, I have the following questions:
 
Did you upgrade from Windows 7 to Windows 8 or 8.1. If you did, did the Windows  7 authorization  key, also authorize versions of Windows 8 or, did you need to purchase a new authorization key for versions of Windows 8;
 
If you had Windows 7 installed but, you decided to install a new installation of Windows 8 or 8.1, were you able to use the windows 7 key, to authorize versions of Windows 8.
 
Were you able to install Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself or, did you have visual assistance;
 
If you installed Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself, was Narrator available to you, to assist you through the installation process; and
 
If Narrator was not available, how didyou install Windows 8 or 8.1 yourself, without visual assistance.
 
I have suggested they upgrade to Windows 10 but, they are adament, they want Windows 8.
 
Dave
 
 


moderated jaws 2020 update?

Leo
 

does anyone know when the next update will be release? the last update was released in June.


--
Best,
   Leo

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