Date   

Re: speaking passwords

Don H
 

You sure can tell the people who have been brain washed by FS.

On 8/18/2018 2:52 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Sat, Aug 18, 2018 at 03:44 PM, Peter Donahue wrote:
To speak or not to speak passwords should be an option the end user
should be able to enable or disable.
You can say this as many times as you like.   But it is utterly untrue if one is taking the idea of security generally seriously and wanting to put out a product that a very great many third parties in the business and government worlds would be apoplectic were it to be used.
It's not all about you (and that's for any you, not you, Peter Donahue).  Your convenience and desires are far from the only consideration.
--
Brian *-*Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134
/The real art of conversation is not only to say the right thing in the right place but to leave unsaid the wrong thing at the tempting moment./
          ~ Dorothy Nevill


Re: speaking passwords

Don H
 

Since in such a situation you would probably have a set of headphones attached so everyone would not be bothered by the noise your idea doesn't hold water.

On 8/18/2018 2:31 PM, Angel wrote:

I also believe, if there is ever the idea given to sighted employers that we blind individuals might required spoken pass words; they will have another excuse not to hire us.  They will believe spoken pass words will further compromise their companies security.
----- Original Message -----
*From:* Brian Vogel <mailto:@britechguy>
*To:* main@jfw.groups.io <mailto:main@jfw.groups.io>
*Sent:* Saturday, August 18, 2018 2:03 PM
*Subject:* Re: speaking passwords
On Sat, Aug 18, 2018 at 02:50 AM, netbat66 wrote:
because sighted people can see the keyboard. we can not.
So?  Most people do not "hunt and peck" type, whether passwords or
anything else.  They're not looking at the keyboard in the vast
majority of cases.  We (as I am part of the group "sighted people")
fat finger our passwords all the time and have to re-enter them.
As far as I'm concerned, VFO has it right.  Passwords should never
be spoken, letter by letter, as they are typed in, anywhere.  A user
is expected to remember them or use a password manager, and most of
those can shoot you right to the webpage and enter the login id and
password both, if conventional coding methods, rather than pop-up
sign-in boxes, are used.
Speaking password character entry entirely defeats the intention of
passwords to begin with.
--
Brian *-*Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134
/The real art of conversation is not only to say the right thing in
the right place but to leave unsaid the wrong thing at the tempting
moment./
       ~ Dorothy Nevill


Re: speaking passwords

 

On Sat, Aug 18, 2018 at 03:50 PM, Bill White wrote:
I would never advocate using spoken passwords in a public or employment situation. Even if we are employed at home, if we are on the phone with someone, they could hear our spoken password.
The problem being, Bill, while yours is a sensible position having this be a user toggle is, from a computer security assessment perspective, an accident waiting to happen.  And it would.

VFO is erring on the side of caution in a situation where caution is desirable, nay, necessary.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The real art of conversation is not only to say the right thing in the right place but to leave unsaid the wrong thing at the tempting moment.

          ~ Dorothy Nevill


Re: speaking passwords

 

On Sat, Aug 18, 2018 at 03:44 PM, Peter Donahue wrote:

To speak or not to speak passwords should be an option the end user should be able to enable or disable.

 

You can say this as many times as you like.   But it is utterly untrue if one is taking the idea of security generally seriously and wanting to put out a product that a very great many third parties in the business and government worlds would be apoplectic were it to be used.

It's not all about you (and that's for any you, not you, Peter Donahue).  Your convenience and desires are far from the only consideration.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The real art of conversation is not only to say the right thing in the right place but to leave unsaid the wrong thing at the tempting moment.

          ~ Dorothy Nevill


Re: speaking passwords

Bill White
 

Hi, Angel. We don’t require spoken passwords. It is just a convenience when we are using our own computers at home, and there is no one there to intercept them. I would never advocate using spoken passwords in a public or employment situation. Even if we are employed at home, if we are on the phone with someone, they could hear our spoken password.

 

Bill White

billwhite92701@...

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of Angel
Sent: Saturday, August 18, 2018 12:31 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: speaking passwords

 

I also believe, if there is ever the idea given to sighted employers that we blind individuals might required spoken pass words; they will have another excuse not to hire us.  They will believe spoken pass words will further compromise their companies security.

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Saturday, August 18, 2018 2:03 PM

Subject: Re: speaking passwords

 

On Sat, Aug 18, 2018 at 02:50 AM, netbat66 wrote:

because sighted people can see the keyboard. we can not.

So?  Most people do not "hunt and peck" type, whether passwords or anything else.  They're not looking at the keyboard in the vast majority of cases.  We (as I am part of the group "sighted people") fat finger our passwords all the time and have to re-enter them.

As far as I'm concerned, VFO has it right.  Passwords should never be spoken, letter by letter, as they are typed in, anywhere.  A user is expected to remember them or use a password manager, and most of those can shoot you right to the webpage and enter the login id and password both, if conventional coding methods, rather than pop-up sign-in boxes, are used.

Speaking password character entry entirely defeats the intention of passwords to begin with.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The real art of conversation is not only to say the right thing in the right place but to leave unsaid the wrong thing at the tempting moment.

          ~ Dorothy Nevill


Re: speaking passwords

Peter Donahue
 

Hello everyone,

 

                To speak or not to speak passwords should be an option the end user should be able to enable or disable.

 

Peter Donahue

 

 

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of Angel
Sent: Saturday, August 18, 2018 2:31 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: speaking passwords

 

I also believe, if there is ever the idea given to sighted employers that we blind individuals might required spoken pass words; they will have another excuse not to hire us.  They will believe spoken pass words will further compromise their companies security.

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Saturday, August 18, 2018 2:03 PM

Subject: Re: speaking passwords

 

On Sat, Aug 18, 2018 at 02:50 AM, netbat66 wrote:

because sighted people can see the keyboard. we can not.

So?  Most people do not "hunt and peck" type, whether passwords or anything else.  They're not looking at the keyboard in the vast majority of cases.  We (as I am part of the group "sighted people") fat finger our passwords all the time and have to re-enter them.

As far as I'm concerned, VFO has it right.  Passwords should never be spoken, letter by letter, as they are typed in, anywhere.  A user is expected to remember them or use a password manager, and most of those can shoot you right to the webpage and enter the login id and password both, if conventional coding methods, rather than pop-up sign-in boxes, are used.

Speaking password character entry entirely defeats the intention of passwords to begin with.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The real art of conversation is not only to say the right thing in the right place but to leave unsaid the wrong thing at the tempting moment.

          ~ Dorothy Nevill


Re: speaking passwords

Angel
 


I also believe, if there is ever the idea given to sighted employers that we blind individuals might required spoken pass words; they will have another excuse not to hire us.  They will believe spoken pass words will further compromise their companies security.

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, August 18, 2018 2:03 PM
Subject: Re: speaking passwords

On Sat, Aug 18, 2018 at 02:50 AM, netbat66 wrote:
because sighted people can see the keyboard. we can not.
So?  Most people do not "hunt and peck" type, whether passwords or anything else.  They're not looking at the keyboard in the vast majority of cases.  We (as I am part of the group "sighted people") fat finger our passwords all the time and have to re-enter them.

As far as I'm concerned, VFO has it right.  Passwords should never be spoken, letter by letter, as they are typed in, anywhere.  A user is expected to remember them or use a password manager, and most of those can shoot you right to the webpage and enter the login id and password both, if conventional coding methods, rather than pop-up sign-in boxes, are used.

Speaking password character entry entirely defeats the intention of passwords to begin with.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The real art of conversation is not only to say the right thing in the right place but to leave unsaid the wrong thing at the tempting moment.

          ~ Dorothy Nevill


Re: programs for opening . rar files

Bill White
 

I use 7-zip to open rar files. If you don't have the latest 7-zip program, you may not be able to open all rar files.

Bill White
billwhite92701@...

-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of Jed Barton
Sent: Saturday, August 18, 2018 11:11 AM
To: main
Subject: programs for opening . rar files

Hey guys,

What's the best program for dealing with .rar files.


Re: programs for opening . rar files

Chris
 

You may find this hard to believe but WinRAR isn’t too bad

Or if you want a free option you cant go wrong with 7-zip

 

Hope that helps

 

 

 

From: Jed Barton
Sent: 18 August 2018 19:10
To: main
Subject: programs for opening . rar files

 

Hey guys,

 

What's the best program for dealing with .rar files.

 

 

 


Re: programs for opening . rar files

Steve Matzura
 

Best is a subjective qualifier; what's best for me might not be best for thee. That having been said, WinZIP, 7Zip, and of course Win-Rar,are all good and all accessible.

On 8/18/2018 2:10 PM, Jed Barton wrote:
Hey guys,

What's the best program for dealing with .rar files.


programs for opening . rar files

Jed Barton <jedbarton@...>
 

Hey guys,

What's the best program for dealing with .rar files.


Re: speaking passwords

 

BTW, I personally hate the whole, "star, star, star, star," thing.  It would be so much less distracting to just use a tone, and a very quick and low volume one, to indicate a key press had occurred.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The real art of conversation is not only to say the right thing in the right place but to leave unsaid the wrong thing at the tempting moment.

          ~ Dorothy Nevill


Re: speaking passwords

 

On Sat, Aug 18, 2018 at 02:50 AM, netbat66 wrote:
because sighted people can see the keyboard. we can not.
So?  Most people do not "hunt and peck" type, whether passwords or anything else.  They're not looking at the keyboard in the vast majority of cases.  We (as I am part of the group "sighted people") fat finger our passwords all the time and have to re-enter them.

As far as I'm concerned, VFO has it right.  Passwords should never be spoken, letter by letter, as they are typed in, anywhere.  A user is expected to remember them or use a password manager, and most of those can shoot you right to the webpage and enter the login id and password both, if conventional coding methods, rather than pop-up sign-in boxes, are used.

Speaking password character entry entirely defeats the intention of passwords to begin with.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The real art of conversation is not only to say the right thing in the right place but to leave unsaid the wrong thing at the tempting moment.

          ~ Dorothy Nevill


Re: file History

 

Richard,

          I have never quite figured out how File History defines "Daily" in terms of there being an exact time each day, particularly if you're like me and unplug your external backup drive for periods of time.  Every time I have plugged in my backup drive after it's been unplugged for some period of time File History eventually kicks on and does that day's daily backup.  You can also choose to go into File History under Control Panel and choose run now to kick off an on-demand run at any time.

          I suggest you have a look at this article on techrepublic.com, How to correctly use File History to transfer data files to a new Windows 10 installation, for a good basic explanation of how to use File History to transfer files between Windows 10 installations.  Be aware he discusses the common mistakes people make first.  Eventually there is a section entitled, The Correct Way,  that gets into how do to it.  Even I will admit that I do not find the method to restore data from one machine to another particularly intuitive at all, quite the opposite in fact, but his steps will talk all about what's actually happening under the hood so that at least you (and I) have some idea about what's actually occurring and why you have had to do some of the things that make you scratch your head when you're first reading the article.

           You may prefer the article on the dummies.com website entitled, HOW TO TRANSFER YOUR FILES TO WINDOWS 10.

            Unless the actual amount of user data, in its entirety, takes up more space than your new computer would allow you should not need to pick and choose.  If you do, this is an area in which I have no firsthand experience and would web search for something like, "File History choose which files to restore," and see what comes up.  You would, of course, have to combine the details of the steps necessary there with the baseline info presented in the aforementioned articles, as you're still restoring from a previous backup from another machine.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Home, 64-Bit, Version 1803, Build 17134  

    The real art of conversation is not only to say the right thing in the right place but to leave unsaid the wrong thing at the tempting moment.

          ~ Dorothy Nevill


Re: speaking passwords

netbat66
 

why couldn't vfo give us the toggle to turn the key presses on and off but do it so it would require a administrator password before the feature could be changed.
then no one else could make any changes.
this would satify there security criteria.

-----Original Message-----
From: Tom
Sent: Saturday, August 18, 2018 2:19 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: speaking passwords

Yes, Jaws should have the ability to either say "star" or the letter as it is typed in. Surely it would not be too difficult to have a toggle in Jaws which would
Allow the user to decide which output was required at the time.

Tom



-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of netbat66
Sent: Saturday, 18 August 2018 4:50 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: speaking passwords

because sighted people can see the keyboard. we can not.
and with me i can not concentrate on the passwords i enter with it saying star
star star with every key press.

-----Original Message-----
From: Sieghard Weitzel
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 10:43 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: speaking passwords

If sighted users can't see the password why should we?


-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Don H
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 2:58 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: speaking passwords

Dam shame that FS doesn't think its users have the capacity to make a
decision to speak passwords or not.

On 8/17/2018 4:47 PM, netbat66 wrote:
rots of ruck.
i asked for this last year and vfo told me this was a security risk and
they would not allow this with any versions of jaws.
and why not?
i am not a business this is home with only me. no one else is going to
see the passwords. unless my dog can talk. grin

-----Original Message----- From: Don H
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 9:59 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: speaking passwords

With both Window Eyes and NVDA you have a option to speak passwords as
you type them in. I sure would like to see this feature in JAWS.









Re: my computer keeps changing volumes.

Jim Rawls
 

Just while jaws is speaking. I have that box unchecked in the  startup wizard unchecked that would lower the volume.

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of Bill White
Sent: Saturday, August 18, 2018 9:30 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: my computer keeps changing volumes.

 

Hi, Jim. Does your volume go up and down only while JAWS is speaking, or is it when in a background program such as Skype, or while a game is running?

 

If it is the latter, you need to go into your Sounds settings, TAB to the Communications tab, and set it to “Do Nothing”.

 

Otherwise, if you are in another program, the volume of JAWS will be reduced substantially.

 

Bill White

billwhite92701@...

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of Jim Rawls
Sent: Saturday, August 18, 2018 7:41 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: my computer keeps changing volumes.

 

Hi all, is this a jaws issue? My volume on my computer will go up slightly and then go down below what I have it set for. I am running windows ten and jaws 2018. Jim


Re: speaking of passwords

Cristóbal
 

I mean I guess. This would honestly though be like feature 65461316546484 down on my list of features/requests/fixes I'd make to VFO.
I use a password mananger anyway, so really it would be rather pointless. Even then, I still don't know why it's needed. Blind folks like to pull out the "well sighted folks can look at the keyboard" card. Ignoring or perhaps not being aware that sighted people often don't look at the keyboard when they're typing just like us. Muscle memory and all that.
This feels more like a solution in search of a problem than anything else.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Alan Robbins via Groups.Io
Sent: Saturday, August 18, 2018 4:30 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: speaking of passwords

Suggestion submitted, let's see what happens.

Al

-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of netbat66
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 10:35 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: speaking of passwords

maybe if we flood there suggestion box they might listen. grin they sure didn't care about it when i asked last year.

-----Original Message-----
From: Don H
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 3:48 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: speaking of passwords


this is the reply from FS on speaking paswords.

-------- Forwarded Message --------
Subject: RE: speaking of passwords
Date: Fri, 17 Aug 2018 22:23:11 +0000
From: VFO Technical Support <support@...>
To: 'Don H' <lmddh50@...>

Thank you for contacting VFO ® Technical Support. The JAWS® program is designed to read what displays on the screen, and, or what is typed on the keyboard. However, since "Passwords" are a secure part of the Windows operating system, JAWS is design to be sensitive to that aspect of the system security. Also, because JAWS is often run by users in public places, business offices, and schools, the screen reader has been designed so that the characters in a user's password are not spoken.
This allows the user to have personal security for their accounts when they use their PC.
Notwithstanding, if you wish to make a recommendation to have this feature added to a future release of JAWS, you should send a message to suggestions@....
If you have any additional questions regarding this or any other issue, please don't hesitate to contact us.
If replying to this message, be sure to include all previous correspondence pertaining to this matter so that we might better assist you.

Sincerely,
Dennis Godin
VFO™ | Technical Support Specialist
11800 31st Court North, St. Petersburg, FL 33716 T 727-803-8000 F 727-803-8001 dgodin@... www.vfogroup.com

The information contained in this communication is confidential, may constitute inside information, and is intended only for the use of the addressee. It is the property of VFO™. Unauthorized use, disclosure or copying of this communication or any part thereof is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by return email, and destroy this communication and all copies thereof, including all attachments.

-----Original Message-----
From: Don H <lmddh50@...> Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 6:02 PM
To: VFO Technical Support <support@...>
Subject: speaking of passwords

It would sure be great for Jaws to have the option to have passwords spoken or not. Tired of being locked out of a account because I mistypes a password.


file History

Richard Turner
 


Thanks to Brian, File History in Windows 10 seems to have worked quite nicely.
A couple of questions:
I selected daily backup. Will it do that automatically when I plug in the drive, or will it assume I want to do it around the same time as the previous day? I didn't find anything within the program to be sure.
When I restore, will I have a choice on what gets restored? I will not want everything back on my new computer as it has a smaller drive than my current computer. The new one will arrive on Wednesday, so I have time to sort things out.
Thanks again for the help.
Richard


"I'll be more enthusiastic about encouraging thinking outside the box when there's evidence of any thinking going on inside it." -- Terry Pratchett



[Sent from my little hand-held computer]



Re: Defining a Hotkey for Use with the BrailleEdge

Richard Turner
 

Here is the Jaws web site on the braille commands for the Focus.
They say for other displays, check with the manufacturer.
https://www.freedomscientific.com/Content/html/jawshq/JAWS-braille-keystrokes.html#BrailleIn

Richard




“The secret is not to make your music louder, but to make the world quieter.” 
- Mitch Albom from The Magic Strings of Frankie Presto, page 1

-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Dani Pagador
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2018 6:52 PM
To: main <main@jfw.groups.io>
Subject: Defining a Hotkey for Use with the BrailleEdge

Hi, Everyone.
I am using JFW17, Win10, and a BrailleEdge. I would like to use the
shift+F3 combination to change the letter case. Using this combination
on the PC keyboard achieves the desired result, as it's a standard
Windows command, I think. But I can't do this same thing using the
BrailleEdge. Is there any way to define a hotkey?

Thanks,
Dani


Re: my computer keeps changing volumes.

Bill White
 

Hi, Jim. Does your volume go up and down only while JAWS is speaking, or is it when in a background program such as Skype, or while a game is running?

 

If it is the latter, you need to go into your Sounds settings, TAB to the Communications tab, and set it to “Do Nothing”.

 

Otherwise, if you are in another program, the volume of JAWS will be reduced substantially.

 

Bill White

billwhite92701@...

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of Jim Rawls
Sent: Saturday, August 18, 2018 7:41 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: my computer keeps changing volumes.

 

Hi all, is this a jaws issue? My volume on my computer will go up slightly and then go down below what I have it set for. I am running windows ten and jaws 2018. Jim