Date   

Re: I still ask about security is it better with crome?

David Moore
 

Hi there,
I am glad you asked this question. As everyone knows, I hope everyone knows, IE has the worst security features that have ever been in any browser. Firefox does have excellent security features. Google Chrome is almost caught up to Firefox, and a new version is coming out soon that will have better security than Firefox. So, along with the many features that are in Chrome, it is very secure. Take care.

-----Original Message-----
From: david via Jfw
Sent: Saturday, November 7, 2015 6:51 PM
To: jfw@lists.the-jdh.com
Cc: david
Subject: I still ask about security is it better with crome?

Hi list members, I'm not sure if my messages are getting to this list but
I'd like to ask about security is there a difference in security features
with crome than with internet explorer? I know that Firefox to me has the
most security as it relates to not being tracked but I'm not sure about the
other things besides privacy settings. I'd like to hear from some other
people to see whether I'm right or not. Thank you for any information that
you might have concerning this topic.

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Re: Assertion that "Chrome is not ready for prime time!"

David Moore
 

Hi Dennis,
I am the original person who said that Google Chrome is totally accessible. My name is David Moore. Well, I didn't litterly mean totally accessible, and I was very excited after working with Chrome after two days. I got carried away. When I saw just how much more accessible Chrome has become in the last two years, I wondered why the blind think that it is still totally inaccessible. A lot of Chrome is accessible, much more than the blind realize. Dennis, It is because of what you said that I have mentioned Chrome on so many lists, and I am encouraging the blind to try it to see for themselves just how far its accessibility has come. It still needs work, I know. But I am asking the same question. Why is Freedom Scientific not putting as much work into making Chrome accessible since it is by far the most used browser in colleges and employment. It makes me wonder and I want the blind to think about this question. I will keep quiet and just leave it right there. By the way, Chrome is just as accessible with NVDA as it is with JAWS. Also, the more tools you have the better off people are. Google Chrome may not be to the point yet to make it your default browser, but it is a good third browser to use. It is good to have two or three screen readers as well. When it comes to streaming TV channels and so on, Chrome beats IE and Firefox hands down. It never crashes once on me. I use Chrome more than IE, because IE crashes almost every time I stream video with it. It will not even open a large web site. Chrome opens large sites twice as fast as IE. Many web sites are accessible with Chrome. I am glad people are realizing it. If I caused a few people to try Chrome, I have done my job which is to help all and bring what is hidden into the light. I am contacting Freedom Scientific on Monday and asking a lot of questions about making Chrome totally accessible and why it hasn't been done already. I urge all of you to do the same. Enjoy Chrome for what it can do, not for what it can not do. Take care all, and thank you Dennis for saying what you did.

-----Original Message-----
From: Pat Byrne via Jfw
Sent: Saturday, November 7, 2015 7:53 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Cc: Pat Byrne
Subject: Re: Assertion that "Chrome is not ready for prime time!"

Dennis,
Very well said.
Pat ByrneAt 06:33 PM 11/7/2015, you wrote:
Hello Gerald and others,
At Harvard and I think Stanford, Google Chrome is used in the programming classes for web development, so they apparently do not share Eric Damery's opinion as presented in the email post. I would be curious to know how recently Eric made that statement. Chrome, at least for sighted programmers is a very important program because it can process the HTML source code from a webpage and present it in a very "human readable" form, as opposed to simply displaying the source code directly in its raw form. As David Malan who teaches CS50 and other web programming courses at Harvard explains in the first class, IE and Firefox do not provide this capability. He doesn't care what browsers students choose to use, he simply explains that it will be much more difficult if one does not use Chrome to do internet programming, because of its built-in tools.

Perhaps Eric meant that Chrome is not ready for prime time for blind people using screen readers. If so, this is obviously very bad news for blind programmers taking CS courses at Harvard and Stanford, since their performance will be measured against sighted students in their classes who are using Chrome, and the blind student's productivity will be seriously diminished and their ability to complete their assignments on time made almost impossible without Chrome.

Likewise, if employers are using Chrome for the same reason as David Malan, and blind programmers can't use it, they are not going to be hired. This isn't discrimination. The employer would be correct in concluding that the blind programmer cannot do the job as quickly and efficiently as a sighted programmer, so to hire the blind programmer would mean the employer is paying the same money for less software output.

I had not looked at Chrome for almost 2 years since I tried to use it in a programming course, and at that time I found it virtually inaccessible using Jaws. When I downloaded it again 2 days ago after reading an earlier email stating that it is now "totally accessible," I was very pleased and surprised at the current level of Chrome's accessibility. Prior to this, I believed their was something about the way Chrome was programmed that made it inherently incompatible with screen readers, but this is clearly not the case.

If Eric actually believes "Chrome isn't ready for prime time", then this
would explain and justify an anemic effort by Freedom Scientific to support Chrome, since no company would spend development capital to support a product which it believes is never going to take hold, or won't mature for a substantial time.

But corporate decision making and assignment of priorities most times falls somewhere between mysterious and inexplicable, and is too often motivated by attempts to gain market advantage, or based on hidden corporate alliances. Who can know? It has become a common practice for salesmen to disparage products they don't sell or can't support, as well as disparaging their own older products when they are now trying to sell their new ones.

I hope Jaws users will download Chrome, try to systematically find its deficiencies with Jaws, and send this information to Freedom Scientific so that Chrome can be made as close to 100 percent accessible as is possible using a screen reader. for us as blind people, software like Chrome is a matter of employment instead of unemployment. When I obtained my MS in computer science in 1984, virtually all computer jobs were available to me, because all programming environments were 100 percent accessible to me using my Braille computer terminal and an Optacon to fill in the gaps.

Today, so much software is inaccessible at a level necessary for employment, that it has become increasingly difficult for us to find and keep jobs of any sort, because most jobs involve using a computer. And as many on this list know through personal experience, that which is accessible today, can easily become inaccessible tomorrow simply because a vendor chooses to release a software upgrade, with unemployment being the result. When the blind employee can no longer perform his job, what is the employer's alternative? The employer is powerless to fix the problem, since they don't write the application software or the screen reader programs. Even if the employer doesn't wish to upgrade because of the effect it will have on the blind employee, a small employer will ultimately have no choice because the software vendor will stop support for the old product to force the business to buy the new product.

I think it is critical that we as customers let Freedom Scientific know what products we need to be made accessible, otherwise they can only guess. This isn't their fault. By definition, they work for a small software company, so the jobs they see and experience are in that environment, and their priorities are established from that vantage point. If your a blind lawyer and you cannot get or keep a job at a mega law firm because the new law firm billing software is not accessible, this is something FS won't experience and won't know about. Likewise, if you're a financial advisor and you cannot get or keep a job at a Wall Street firm or mega bank, FS will not know what job critical software must be made accessible unless they are told. These are examples of the places where jobs are located, and we cannot get and keep those jobs if we are unable to use the software on which the jobs are based. Last time I checked into this, most of the corporate networks for these large firms are still running Windows XP, very old versions of MS Office, and the inaccessible applications they are running are not Microsoft products. I would be curious to know how much money and effort FS has spent on IE 11 accessibility as opposed to Google Chrome.

Just my 2 cents worth, but accounting for inflation may be worth 4 cents, though probably not quite that much.

----- Original Message ----- From: "Gerald Levy via Jfw" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Cc: "Gerald Levy" <bwaylimited@verizon.net>
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2015 8:35 AM
Subject: Re: Chrome and bookmarks/favorites



Which explains why Eric Damery still advises JAWS users to avoid Chrome.
As far as he is concerned, Chrome is still not ready yet for prime time.

Gerald



-----Original Message----- From: Adrian Spratt via Jfw
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2015 10:51 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Cc: Adrian Spratt
Subject: Chrome and bookmarks/favorites

Hi.

I can't get favorites, which Chrome calls bookmarks, to work as quickly as
they do in IE. Here's what I've figured out so far. I hope the gaps can be
filled in.

You get to bookmarks by pressing alt for the menu, then arrowing down.
Press enter on bookmarks. Here, I'm told that the shortcut control-shift-b
brings up bookmarks, but that shortcut isn't working on my system when I'm
outside this menu. Each time I have to go through the menu.

In IE, I press alt-a to bring up my favorites list, and first-letter
navigation works. I can't find anything this simple using Chrome.

One item in the bookmarks submenu allows you to import favorites settings.
I clicked on this, tabbed through the options, and was told at the end
that I was successful. However, nothing seems to have been imported.

Any ideas?
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Re: Chrome vs firefox

David Moore
 

Hi all,
That is how I look at Google Chrome. Chrome is not accessible everywhere, but it sure gives us a third tool to use. Also, IE 11 crashes on me almost every time I try to stream TV shows with it. When I stream with Chrome, it has never crashed once on me. Chrome is the best by far if you are going to stream video, play music on line, and watch net flicks and so on. Take care all.

-----Original Message-----
From: Dennis Clark via Jfw
Sent: Saturday, November 7, 2015 8:56 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Cc: Dennis Clark
Subject: Re: Chrome vs firefox

Hi Marianne,
I have also been switching between IE and Firefox for some time. I often for
example find that I can't activate buttons on an Amazon page,so I copy the
URL from the IE address field, then load Firefox. After loading Firefox and
pasting the URL into the address field and loading the page, I can usually
activate the buttons which I could not with IE. On the other hand, sometimes
when I start out with Firefox on the initial Amazon screen, the entire
screen is blank, and the page never seems to load. Having Google Chrome as a
third possibility, should certainly add to our arsenal of tools in an all to
often inaccessible world.
Dennis


----- Original Message -----
From: "Marianne Denning via Jfw" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Cc: "Marianne Denning" <marianne@denningweb.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2015 2:42 PM
Subject: Re: Chrome vs firefox


I have used Firefox and IE for several years. I go back and forth
because some websites are better with one and some with the other.
Now that I hear Crome is accessible I plan to give it a try. I have
been using Google Drive and like it.

On 11/7/15, Drew Hunthausen via Jfw <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com> wrote:
Dear list,

I'm a life time user of IE and due to the way many of the aspects of my job
and related software works have been advised to switch to Chrome or
Firefox.
What is the learning curve in switching from IE, and is there anything else
I should be aware of. I haven't upgraded yet, but I do have Jaws 17. Thanks
so much

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--
Marianne Denning, TVI, MA
Teacher of students who are blind or visually impaired
(513) 607-6053

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Re: Google Chrome

Ann Byrne
 

That worked. Thanks.

At 10:21 PM 11/7/2015, you wrote:
Try pressing control-shift-a, then tab to something like "don't ask again." that's how I got past it.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Ann Byrne via Jfw
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2015 11:05 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Cc: Ann Byrne
Subject: Google Chrome

The first thing that happened when I opened Google Chrome was the
question did I want it as my default browser, which I don't. JAWS 17
read that there were buttons for yes, no, and don't ask me again ...
but I couldn't access them with tab, arrow keys, or the JAWS cursor.


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Re: Google Chrome

Adrian Spratt
 

Try pressing control-shift-a, then tab to something like "don't ask again." that's how I got past it.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Ann Byrne via Jfw
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2015 11:05 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Cc: Ann Byrne
Subject: Google Chrome

The first thing that happened when I opened Google Chrome was the
question did I want it as my default browser, which I don't. JAWS 17
read that there were buttons for yes, no, and don't ask me again ...
but I couldn't access them with tab, arrow keys, or the JAWS cursor.


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chrome & feeds

john.falter
 

This is taken from:
http://www.xml2u.com/Google-Chrome/
I haven't tried it yet.
.....
How to view an RSS feed in Google Chrome



In order to view an RSS feed in Google's Chrome browser it is necessary to add the RSS Chrome Extension.


This is a very simple process and the steps are as follows:
• In your Chrome browser open https://chrome.google.com/webstore/search/rss?hl=en-US


•Enter 'RSS Feed Reader' in the search box (top left)


•Press your 'Enter' key


•In the results click the '+ Add to Chrome' button next to 'RSS Feed Reader'

Chrome will now display RSS feeds.


Google Chrome

Ann Byrne
 

The first thing that happened when I opened Google Chrome was the question did I want it as my default browser, which I don't. JAWS 17 read that there were buttons for yes, no, and don't ask me again ... but I couldn't access them with tab, arrow keys, or the JAWS cursor.


Email Ascending vs. Descending

Dave...
 

Carolyn,

Are you grouping your messages, perhaps? If they are grouped so that each
subject requires expanding, then it will default to ascending, regardless of
your view settings. If you have descending set and are not grouping, then I
would expect them to be sorted descending.

Dave Carlson
Oregonian, woodworker, Engineer, Musician, and Pioneer

----- Original Message -----
From: "Carolyn Arnold via Jfw" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Cc: "Carolyn Arnold" <4carolyna@windstream.net>
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2015 09:40 AM
Subject: Outlook 2013.


Yesterday, we ran a full systems scan. Since that time, I noticed that
the e-mails in my Inbox, not my others, were in descending order. I went
in and checked back on ascending. Yet, they are still coming in
descending order. Anyone have any idea how I can make it do my way,
e-mails in ascending order. I checked back, and ascending is checked.
Thanks for any ideas.



Best from,



Carolyn



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Re: Merge Utility, Why It's Missing, Explained

HAMILTON
 

Aidan :

Thanks. I'll take a look. Mostly, I use Word, Outlook and IE 11, and I
imagine these would be generic enough to be easily handled by this programme
that you have described. Also, I will more closely explore NVDA. I have used
Window Eyes in the distant past; but, I found that users had to do much more
customizing than with JAWS. I've heard that NVDA operates in very much the
same way as JAWS, and it's free. However regardless of the last item, I want
to find what I can use most easily.

Jim H

-----Original Message-----
From: Aidan [mailto:aidan.smarttalk@gmail.com]
Sent: Saturday, November 7, 2015 3:34 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list. <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Subject: Re: Merge Utility, Why It's Missing, Explained

Well, its not that jaws have tuns of features that supernova don't,
they can mostly do the same things feature wise, its just that jaws
support the most and give the most access by means of many scripts.
While supernova make use of scritps, and also map files, the veriety
is not as huge and don't fall in the catogories of software I normally
would use. But that being said, that doesn't mean that it won't work
with many software you already have, but that you have to test. Chrome
currently will be a problem. But many things does work, and since many
here use office for example, that will work seemlessly. Get a demo and
try it,

www.yourdolphin.com

On 07/11/2015, Jim Hamilton via Jfw <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com> wrote:
Dr. Tom Behler:

Thanks. Did you follow up by writing to the "suggestions" link in the body
of that generic response? I think that this is where the power-to-change
exists within FS.

"Power to the people!"

Jim H

-----Original Message-----
From: Tom Behler [mailto:tombehler@gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, November 6, 2015 4:07 PM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.' <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Subject: RE: Merge Utility, Why It's Missing, Explained

Jim and all:

I sent my letter of discontent in early this morning, and got the generic
response.

Hopefully others will do the same.

Dr. Tom Behler from Michigan


-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Jim Hamilton
via Jfw
Sent: Friday, November 06, 2015 3:37 PM
To: 'Kramlinger, Keith G., M.D.'; 'The Jaws for Windows support list.'
Cc: Jim Hamilton
Subject: RE: Merge Utility, Why It's Missing, Explained

Well, I must say that it is most gratifying to see that lots of other JAWS
users are upset with losing the Merge Utility! I hate to be the only one
screaming in the wilderness. I have already used the below link to
complain, and received the typical FS reply that someone would be in touch.
I agree that the more people who let FS know about their feelings on this,
and any other, matter, makes a lot of sense. It is the noisy wheel that
gets greased! Let's keep those cards and letters coming in!

Jim H

-----Original Message-----
From: Kramlinger, Keith G., M.D. [mailto:kramlinger.keith@mayo.edu]
Sent: Thursday, November 5, 2015 11:31 AM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.' <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Subject: RE: Merge Utility, Why It's Missing, Explained

What's the traffic volume like on the JAWS-Users group?

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Mike B via
Jfw
Sent: Wednesday, November 04, 2015 11:41 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Cc: Mike B
Subject: Re: Merge Utility, Why It's Missing, Explained

Hi Adrian,

Believe me, I would like to rollover & stick at least 1 of my 4 legs up 1
of
someone's ass at Freedom Scientific but, it seems like, most of the time
anyways, they don't give a rats ass about what we the consumer think & go
on
their merry way! I do agree that if people complained in more volume it
might make more of an impact but, if these complaints fall upon deaf ears,
so to speak, complaining won't change anything either, just as it hasn't
changed crap like this in, forever, with FS. I can tell you 1 way of
making
1 of the most important people within Fs, Eric Damry, aware of how you
feel,
& that is to join another email list, Jaws-Users. Eric Damry is a member
of
this list & is a somewhat frequent poster depending on the topic, to the
list. Here is the necessary link to join if interested.

To join:

jaws-users-list-join@jaws-users.com

Click on the link above, put subscribe in the subject line, leave the
message body empty, & send. You'll receive a confirmation email, reply to
it & you should be good to go.

It's not a real high traffic list.

Take care.
Mike
This email was sent from my, iBarstool. Go Dodgers, next year anyways!

----- Original Message -----
From: Adrian Spratt via Jfw
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Cc: Adrian Spratt
Sent: Wednesday, November 04, 2015 9:09 PM
Subject: RE: Merge Utility, Why It's Missing, Explained


Mike,

Understood. The temptation to roll over and stick my four legs up in the
air

is sometimes strong, but over time I've found that persistence and volume
can prevail. By persistence, I mean one person demanding a fix. By volume,
I

mean the more of us who complain, the more pressure FS will be under to fix
it and ensure this kind of fiasco doesn't recur.

I do recall many versions ago that the merge utility cause havoc from one
version to the next. The people at FS remember that event. I also know that
persistence doesn't always work. I've had my own frustrations with FS over
time.

But the merge utility was basic to the transition from version to version,
and most of us JAWS users depended on it. It's bad enough that we must pay
for a SMA every two versions, which FS has ensured means every two years,
but now to go through such inconvenience as well?

As for the lister who proposed a petition, let him produce one. Otherwise,
it's simple enough to write to FS and let our voices be heard. Again, the
address is

support@freedomscientific.com

I admit I don't like being a rabble-rouser, but this really is annoying.
-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Mike B via
Jfw
Sent: Wednesday, November 04, 2015 11:42 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Cc: Mike B
Subject: Re: Merge Utility, Why It's Missing, Explained

Hi Adrian,

I agree with you &, I don't find it acceptable either but, what else are we
supposed to do? We can bitch until the cows come home & it won't change
the
fact, that Freedom Scientific already knows, they are not keeping up with
their own products. I've complained about various screw-ups for many
years,
& when you send them a complaint you only get back an automated kiss ass
email stating how they're working to resolve the problem. It seems to me
that they have a need to stay on some kind of schedule, & that schedule is
to put out a new version of Jaws around November of each year whether it's
ready for consumer consumption or not!
Take care.
Mike
This email was sent from my, iBarstool. Go Dodgers, next year anyways!

----- Original Message -----
From: Adrian Spratt via Jfw
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Cc: Adrian Spratt
Sent: Wednesday, November 04, 2015 7:46 PM
Subject: RE: Merge Utility, Why It's Missing, Explained


Sorry, Mike, but I don't find this statement acceptable. Ease of transition
from version to version is important. FS should have anticipated this
concern and figured out a solution before it became our problem. As I
believe it was Aidan who pointed out, it isn't as if the new features in
JAWS 17 are exactly compelling. There are potential problems involved in
skipping a version, so I still plan to install JAWS 17 one of these days.
Once again, I encourage anyone who feels as I do to contact FS Tech Support
at

support@freedomscientific.com

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Mike B via
Jfw
Sent: Wednesday, November 04, 2015 9:36 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Cc: Mike B
Subject: Merge Utility, Why It's Missing, Explained

Hi All,

There's no need to craft a petition or anything else. Below tells about
the
Merge Utility & why it's missing in Jaws 17, for now anyways. This comes
from What's new in Jaws 17.

Merge Utility No Longer Available

Major changes have been made to improve the JAWS localization process. This
included reorganizing many of the JAWS settings files. Due to these
changes,
the Merge utility is no longer installed with JAWS 17 as settings from
prior
versions cannot be merged. We are planning a solution for the future which
will replace this utility and provide an even greater benefit for our
customers.

Take care.
Mike
This email was sent from my, iBarstool. Go Dodgers, next year anyways!

----- Original Message -----
From: Tom Behler via Jfw
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.'
Cc: Tom Behler
Sent: Wednesday, November 04, 2015 5:32 PM
Subject: RE: merge utility


I don't know how appropriate or beneficial this could be, but if someone on
the list would be willing to craft a petition regarding this issue, we
might
be able to get enough signitures to make an impact.

Sometimes, I just scratch my head at these kinds of decisions.

I certainly will sign any such petition, if it is created.

I'm looking to upgrade to Jaws 17, possibly during the college teaching
semester break, but that won't be for about 8 weeks for me at this point,
and I sure would like to have the use of the merge utilities feature again.
I know there have been issues with it at times, but the convenience and
ease
of using it far outweighs any problems, in my opinion.

Dr. Tom Behler from Michigan



-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Adrian Spratt
via Jfw
Sent: Wednesday, November 04, 2015 5:58 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Cc: Adrian Spratt
Subject: RE: merge utility

I'm going to write to FS Tech Support and ask for this deficiency to be
fixed. I hope others will do the same so they realize how important this
is.
Can you imagine a popular commercial application forcing users to start all
over again with the settings they've created over the course of years? Note
that "merge" was misspelled in the subject line, which I've corrected.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Maria
Campbell
via Jfw
Sent: Wednesday, November 04, 2015 5:43 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Cc: Maria Campbell
Subject: Re: murge utility

I agree completely. Enough said.

On 11/4/2015 4:23 PM, Aidan via Jfw wrote:
Hello.

I'm very upset for fs removing the murg utility option in jaws 17.
They have the excuse that older version settings can know longer being
important in 17. I don't know if I must laugh. If they new that it
would happen, why did they not make a priority to implement a
replacement tool wich could be in 17?
Now you have to manually change everything? Is it possible perhaps to
use the settings packager to acomplish that?
I find it so tragic that they spend the hole year on smart navigation,
wich is not even such a remarkable feature, really this was going to
be more bennifishil to more people and now that its not ready it will
affect everyone negatively.

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Trials without God will break you. Trials with God will make you.

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Re: jaws 17 braille error in windows10

Debbie April Yuille
 

Hi Mark

What Braille Display are you using? Also are you running a 32-bit or 64-bit
operating system? If you are running a 64-bit OS, then Braille Displays must
have signed drivers to be able to work under the OS.

Debbie
Skype: apparating.girl

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Mark Furness
via Jfw
Sent: Sunday, 8 November 2015 2:04 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list. <Jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Cc: Mark Furness <flintman57@gmail.com>
Subject: jaws 17 braille error in windows10

Every time I start my PC Jaws says the braille driver can not be loaded
because jaws could not verify its digital signature
the file is
c:\programdata\freedom scientific\jaws\17.0\settings\enu\default.jcf

How do I fix this problem?
Thank you for your help.

Mark
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Re: Chrome vs firefox

Dennis Clark <dennis@...>
 

Hi Marianne,
I have also been switching between IE and Firefox for some time. I often for example find that I can't activate buttons on an Amazon page,so I copy the URL from the IE address field, then load Firefox. After loading Firefox and pasting the URL into the address field and loading the page, I can usually activate the buttons which I could not with IE. On the other hand, sometimes when I start out with Firefox on the initial Amazon screen, the entire screen is blank, and the page never seems to load. Having Google Chrome as a third possibility, should certainly add to our arsenal of tools in an all to often inaccessible world.
Dennis

----- Original Message -----
From: "Marianne Denning via Jfw" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Cc: "Marianne Denning" <marianne@denningweb.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2015 2:42 PM
Subject: Re: Chrome vs firefox


I have used Firefox and IE for several years. I go back and forth
because some websites are better with one and some with the other.
Now that I hear Crome is accessible I plan to give it a try. I have
been using Google Drive and like it.

On 11/7/15, Drew Hunthausen via Jfw <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com> wrote:
Dear list,

I'm a life time user of IE and due to the way many of the aspects of my job
and related software works have been advised to switch to Chrome or
Firefox.
What is the learning curve in switching from IE, and is there anything else
I should be aware of. I haven't upgraded yet, but I do have Jaws 17. Thanks
so much

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Teacher of students who are blind or visually impaired
(513) 607-6053

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Re: Assertion that "Chrome is not ready for prime time!"

Pat Byrne
 

Dennis,
Very well said.
Pat ByrneAt 06:33 PM 11/7/2015, you wrote:

Hello Gerald and others,
At Harvard and I think Stanford, Google Chrome is used in the programming classes for web development, so they apparently do not share Eric Damery's opinion as presented in the email post. I would be curious to know how recently Eric made that statement. Chrome, at least for sighted programmers is a very important program because it can process the HTML source code from a webpage and present it in a very "human readable" form, as opposed to simply displaying the source code directly in its raw form. As David Malan who teaches CS50 and other web programming courses at Harvard explains in the first class, IE and Firefox do not provide this capability. He doesn't care what browsers students choose to use, he simply explains that it will be much more difficult if one does not use Chrome to do internet programming, because of its built-in tools.

Perhaps Eric meant that Chrome is not ready for prime time for blind people using screen readers. If so, this is obviously very bad news for blind programmers taking CS courses at Harvard and Stanford, since their performance will be measured against sighted students in their classes who are using Chrome, and the blind student's productivity will be seriously diminished and their ability to complete their assignments on time made almost impossible without Chrome.

Likewise, if employers are using Chrome for the same reason as David Malan, and blind programmers can't use it, they are not going to be hired. This isn't discrimination. The employer would be correct in concluding that the blind programmer cannot do the job as quickly and efficiently as a sighted programmer, so to hire the blind programmer would mean the employer is paying the same money for less software output.

I had not looked at Chrome for almost 2 years since I tried to use it in a programming course, and at that time I found it virtually inaccessible using Jaws. When I downloaded it again 2 days ago after reading an earlier email stating that it is now "totally accessible," I was very pleased and surprised at the current level of Chrome's accessibility. Prior to this, I believed their was something about the way Chrome was programmed that made it inherently incompatible with screen readers, but this is clearly not the case.

If Eric actually believes "Chrome isn't ready for prime time", then this
would explain and justify an anemic effort by Freedom Scientific to support Chrome, since no company would spend development capital to support a product which it believes is never going to take hold, or won't mature for a substantial time.

But corporate decision making and assignment of priorities most times falls somewhere between mysterious and inexplicable, and is too often motivated by attempts to gain market advantage, or based on hidden corporate alliances. Who can know? It has become a common practice for salesmen to disparage products they don't sell or can't support, as well as disparaging their own older products when they are now trying to sell their new ones.

I hope Jaws users will download Chrome, try to systematically find its deficiencies with Jaws, and send this information to Freedom Scientific so that Chrome can be made as close to 100 percent accessible as is possible using a screen reader. for us as blind people, software like Chrome is a matter of employment instead of unemployment. When I obtained my MS in computer science in 1984, virtually all computer jobs were available to me, because all programming environments were 100 percent accessible to me using my Braille computer terminal and an Optacon to fill in the gaps.

Today, so much software is inaccessible at a level necessary for employment, that it has become increasingly difficult for us to find and keep jobs of any sort, because most jobs involve using a computer. And as many on this list know through personal experience, that which is accessible today, can easily become inaccessible tomorrow simply because a vendor chooses to release a software upgrade, with unemployment being the result. When the blind employee can no longer perform his job, what is the employer's alternative? The employer is powerless to fix the problem, since they don't write the application software or the screen reader programs. Even if the employer doesn't wish to upgrade because of the effect it will have on the blind employee, a small employer will ultimately have no choice because the software vendor will stop support for the old product to force the business to buy the new product.

I think it is critical that we as customers let Freedom Scientific know what products we need to be made accessible, otherwise they can only guess. This isn't their fault. By definition, they work for a small software company, so the jobs they see and experience are in that environment, and their priorities are established from that vantage point. If your a blind lawyer and you cannot get or keep a job at a mega law firm because the new law firm billing software is not accessible, this is something FS won't experience and won't know about. Likewise, if you're a financial advisor and you cannot get or keep a job at a Wall Street firm or mega bank, FS will not know what job critical software must be made accessible unless they are told. These are examples of the places where jobs are located, and we cannot get and keep those jobs if we are unable to use the software on which the jobs are based. Last time I checked into this, most of the corporate networks for these large firms are still running Windows XP, very old versions of MS Office, and the inaccessible applications they are running are not Microsoft products. I would be curious to know how much money and effort FS has spent on IE 11 accessibility as opposed to Google Chrome.

Just my 2 cents worth, but accounting for inflation may be worth 4 cents, though probably not quite that much.

----- Original Message ----- From: "Gerald Levy via Jfw" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Cc: "Gerald Levy" <bwaylimited@verizon.net>
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2015 8:35 AM
Subject: Re: Chrome and bookmarks/favorites



Which explains why Eric Damery still advises JAWS users to avoid Chrome.
As far as he is concerned, Chrome is still not ready yet for prime time.

Gerald



-----Original Message----- From: Adrian Spratt via Jfw
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2015 10:51 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Cc: Adrian Spratt
Subject: Chrome and bookmarks/favorites

Hi.

I can't get favorites, which Chrome calls bookmarks, to work as quickly as
they do in IE. Here's what I've figured out so far. I hope the gaps can be
filled in.

You get to bookmarks by pressing alt for the menu, then arrowing down.
Press enter on bookmarks. Here, I'm told that the shortcut control-shift-b
brings up bookmarks, but that shortcut isn't working on my system when I'm
outside this menu. Each time I have to go through the menu.

In IE, I press alt-a to bring up my favorites list, and first-letter
navigation works. I can't find anything this simple using Chrome.

One item in the bookmarks submenu allows you to import favorites settings.
I clicked on this, tabbed through the options, and was told at the end
that I was successful. However, nothing seems to have been imported.

Any ideas?
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Assertion that "Chrome is not ready for prime time!"

Dennis Clark <dennis@...>
 

Hello Gerald and others,
At Harvard and I think Stanford, Google Chrome is used in the programming classes for web development, so they apparently do not share Eric Damery's opinion as presented in the email post. I would be curious to know how recently Eric made that statement. Chrome, at least for sighted programmers is a very important program because it can process the HTML source code from a webpage and present it in a very "human readable" form, as opposed to simply displaying the source code directly in its raw form. As David Malan who teaches CS50 and other web programming courses at Harvard explains in the first class, IE and Firefox do not provide this capability. He doesn't care what browsers students choose to use, he simply explains that it will be much more difficult if one does not use Chrome to do internet programming, because of its built-in tools.

Perhaps Eric meant that Chrome is not ready for prime time for blind people using screen readers. If so, this is obviously very bad news for blind programmers taking CS courses at Harvard and Stanford, since their performance will be measured against sighted students in their classes who are using Chrome, and the blind student's productivity will be seriously diminished and their ability to complete their assignments on time made almost impossible without Chrome.

Likewise, if employers are using Chrome for the same reason as David Malan, and blind programmers can't use it, they are not going to be hired. This isn't discrimination. The employer would be correct in concluding that the blind programmer cannot do the job as quickly and efficiently as a sighted programmer, so to hire the blind programmer would mean the employer is paying the same money for less software output.

I had not looked at Chrome for almost 2 years since I tried to use it in a programming course, and at that time I found it virtually inaccessible using Jaws. When I downloaded it again 2 days ago after reading an earlier email stating that it is now "totally accessible," I was very pleased and surprised at the current level of Chrome's accessibility. Prior to this, I believed their was something about the way Chrome was programmed that made it inherently incompatible with screen readers, but this is clearly not the case.

If Eric actually believes "Chrome isn't ready for prime time", then this
would explain and justify an anemic effort by Freedom Scientific to support Chrome, since no company would spend development capital to support a product which it believes is never going to take hold, or won't mature for a substantial time.

But corporate decision making and assignment of priorities most times falls somewhere between mysterious and inexplicable, and is too often motivated by attempts to gain market advantage, or based on hidden corporate alliances. Who can know? It has become a common practice for salesmen to disparage products they don't sell or can't support, as well as disparaging their own older products when they are now trying to sell their new ones.

I hope Jaws users will download Chrome, try to systematically find its deficiencies with Jaws, and send this information to Freedom Scientific so that Chrome can be made as close to 100 percent accessible as is possible using a screen reader. for us as blind people, software like Chrome is a matter of employment instead of unemployment. When I obtained my MS in computer science in 1984, virtually all computer jobs were available to me, because all programming environments were 100 percent accessible to me using my Braille computer terminal and an Optacon to fill in the gaps.

Today, so much software is inaccessible at a level necessary for employment, that it has become increasingly difficult for us to find and keep jobs of any sort, because most jobs involve using a computer. And as many on this list know through personal experience, that which is accessible today, can easily become inaccessible tomorrow simply because a vendor chooses to release a software upgrade, with unemployment being the result. When the blind employee can no longer perform his job, what is the employer's alternative? The employer is powerless to fix the problem, since they don't write the application software or the screen reader programs. Even if the employer doesn't wish to upgrade because of the effect it will have on the blind employee, a small employer will ultimately have no choice because the software vendor will stop support for the old product to force the business to buy the new product.

I think it is critical that we as customers let Freedom Scientific know what products we need to be made accessible, otherwise they can only guess. This isn't their fault. By definition, they work for a small software company, so the jobs they see and experience are in that environment, and their priorities are established from that vantage point. If your a blind lawyer and you cannot get or keep a job at a mega law firm because the new law firm billing software is not accessible, this is something FS won't experience and won't know about. Likewise, if you're a financial advisor and you cannot get or keep a job at a Wall Street firm or mega bank, FS will not know what job critical software must be made accessible unless they are told. These are examples of the places where jobs are located, and we cannot get and keep those jobs if we are unable to use the software on which the jobs are based. Last time I checked into this, most of the corporate networks for these large firms are still running Windows XP, very old versions of MS Office, and the inaccessible applications they are running are not Microsoft products. I would be curious to know how much money and effort FS has spent on IE 11 accessibility as opposed to Google Chrome.

Just my 2 cents worth, but accounting for inflation may be worth 4 cents, though probably not quite that much.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Gerald Levy via Jfw" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Cc: "Gerald Levy" <bwaylimited@verizon.net>
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2015 8:35 AM
Subject: Re: Chrome and bookmarks/favorites



Which explains why Eric Damery still advises JAWS users to avoid Chrome.
As far as he is concerned, Chrome is still not ready yet for prime time.

Gerald



-----Original Message-----
From: Adrian Spratt via Jfw
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2015 10:51 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Cc: Adrian Spratt
Subject: Chrome and bookmarks/favorites

Hi.

I can't get favorites, which Chrome calls bookmarks, to work as quickly as
they do in IE. Here's what I've figured out so far. I hope the gaps can be
filled in.

You get to bookmarks by pressing alt for the menu, then arrowing down.
Press enter on bookmarks. Here, I'm told that the shortcut control-shift-b
brings up bookmarks, but that shortcut isn't working on my system when I'm
outside this menu. Each time I have to go through the menu.

In IE, I press alt-a to bring up my favorites list, and first-letter
navigation works. I can't find anything this simple using Chrome.

One item in the bookmarks submenu allows you to import favorites settings.
I clicked on this, tabbed through the options, and was told at the end
that I was successful. However, nothing seems to have been imported.

Any ideas?
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I still ask about security is it better with crome?

David Ingram
 

Hi list members, I'm not sure if my messages are getting to this list but
I'd like to ask about security is there a difference in security features
with crome than with internet explorer? I know that Firefox to me has the
most security as it relates to not being tracked but I'm not sure about the
other things besides privacy settings. I'd like to hear from some other
people to see whether I'm right or not. Thank you for any information that
you might have concerning this topic.

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Re: Jaws and the Cloud, was Jfw Digest, Vol 54, Issue 7

Peter Donahue
 

Good afternoon,

There are public and private clouds. FS would obviously use a private cloud to address privacy concerns. We use a number of cloud applications and have not had issues with our privacy being compromized or our devices being hacked. Being able to have JAWS reload user settings and configurations from the cloud would be a welcome feature in a future version.

Peter Donahue




Jim Hamilton via Jfw wrote:

Sorry folks! My overriding concern is "privacy", of which there is NONE in
the cloud! And, it's yet more information available "out there" for anyone,
with the skills, to find about me, or anyone else!

OK; so, I'm a technical dinosaur; bbut, I'm not alone.

Jim H

-----Original Message-----
From: David Moore [mailto:jesusloves1966@gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, November 6, 2015 5:22 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list. <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Subject: Re: Jaws and the Cloud, was Re: Jfw Digest, Vol 54, Issue 7

Hi all,
Having all settings, scripts, and all changes we make to JAWS stored in the
cloud excites me a lot. If FS created a service for us to do this, We would
never lose our settings and our own scripts ever again. I agree. Bring it
on.


-----Original Message-----
From: Peter Donahue via Jfw
Sent: Friday, November 6, 2015 5:09 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Cc: Peter Donahue
Subject: Re: Jaws and the Cloud, was Re: Jfw Digest, Vol 54, Issue 7

Hello everyone,

For some having JAWS store your user settings in the cloud is big.
I have made this suggestion to FS for some time and would like to see it
become a reality. Your authorization code would be stored with your user
settings allowing JAWS to retrieve information such as saved settings
whenever you upgrade to a new version or install and authorize it on
another device. Bring it on FS!

Peter Donahue



Soronel Haetir via Jfw wrote:
The only possible benefit I could see of allowing jaws to save
settings to the cloud is if they loosen the licensing system so that
it is easier for a single user to use many devices.

On 11/6/15, Jim Hamilton via Jfw <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com> wrote:
For one, I will continue to ignore requests to store "anything" in the
cloud! There is already far too much information out there, online,
about
myself, and don't want any additional windows into my life. If FS has
this
in mind for saving/changing our JAWS settings, I will strongly protest.
Of
course, before protesting, I will wait to see what happens.

Jim H
-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of
jfw-request@lists.the-jdh.com
Sent: Thursday, November 5, 2015 12:19 PM
To: jfw@lists.the-jdh.com
Subject: Jfw Digest, Vol 54, Issue 7

Send Jfw mailing list submissions to
jfw@lists.the-jdh.com

To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
http://lists.the-jdh.com/mailman/listinfo/jfw_lists.the-jdh.com
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
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You can reach the person managing the list at
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Jfw digest..."



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Re: Chrome vs firefox

Marianne Denning
 

I have used Firefox and IE for several years. I go back and forth
because some websites are better with one and some with the other.
Now that I hear Crome is accessible I plan to give it a try. I have
been using Google Drive and like it.

On 11/7/15, Drew Hunthausen via Jfw <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com> wrote:
Dear list,

I'm a life time user of IE and due to the way many of the aspects of my job
and related software works have been advised to switch to Chrome or
Firefox.
What is the learning curve in switching from IE, and is there anything else
I should be aware of. I haven't upgraded yet, but I do have Jaws 17. Thanks
so much

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Teacher of students who are blind or visually impaired
(513) 607-6053


Chrome and Twitter

Andre Jarreau <andre.jarreau@...>
 

I may be doing something wrong. At the Google home page in Chrome I want to
go to Twitter.com and can't seem to get there. Tried keystrokes common in
IE but didn't work in Chrome.



Does anyone know the keystroke commands to get to Twitter? Thanks


Re: Google Chrome is totally accessible

Carolyn Arnold <4carolyna@...>
 

I have a Desktop - Windows 10 with Office 2013 with Outlook, and JAWS 17


Bye for now,

Carolyn

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Rex Leslie
Howard, Jr. via Jfw
Sent: Saturday, November 7, 2015 4:00 PM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.' <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Cc: Rex Leslie Howard, Jr. <rex.howard@gmail.com>
Subject: RE: Google Chrome is totally accessible

Okay Carolyn what version of Jaws are you using?
I need to know because I'm going to get you to do things with the touch
cursor.
You don't need a touch screen to use the touch cursor and it can go
places other cursors can't go. So, one more question, do you use a laptop
layout for your keyboard or a standard desktop layout?

So, once more: What version of Jaws and what keyboard layout do you use.


-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Carolyn
Arnold via Jfw
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2015 2:48 PM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.'
Cc: Carolyn Arnold
Subject: RE: Google Chrome is totally accessible

Thank you. This is very helpful.

I do not have Skype or have never used it, so it is not set up.

Bye for now,

Carolyn


-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Rex Leslie
Howard, Jr. via Jfw
Sent: Saturday, November 7, 2015 3:44 PM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.' <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Cc: Rex Leslie Howard, Jr. <rex.howard@gmail.com>
Subject: RE: Google Chrome is totally accessible

Hey Carolyn you seem to have quite a few answered questions. I'll be glad
to help you. Let me know if you have skype and I'll get online with you
and help you resolve these problems. To To turn forms mode from manual to
automatic or vice versa do this:
1. Press insert plus the number six on your numbers row. Actually I say
press insert, let me rephrase. Press the Jaws key plus the number 6.
2. Type the word "form" when you are presented with the edit box. Now tab
over one time and you should be in the forms mode options. Press the
spacebar to toggle between automatic and manual and there may be another
option. In fact there is: it's called semiauto.
3. If you want to change this setting and have it effect all programs you
will need to press the control key the shift key and the letter D
immediately after pressing Jaws key plus the number six that we started
with.
D


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Re: Chrome vs firefox

Tony
 

Glad to hear about flash. It rarely is willing to install on my machine
with IE.

Tony

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Aidan via Jfw
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2015 2:41 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Cc: Aidan
Subject: Re: Chrome vs firefox

Tony, I really suggest you try it, because explorer is not a good option
anymore. A brouzer nees to be updated allot, and that is not happening for a
while now. MS cannot expect its exceptable to update the brouzer each time
they do anew windows. That is where chrome is firstly better, the more it
update the more it can protect you. And the way it work technically and
otherwise just come down to a safer online experience. And flash is build in
wich is also safer and it plays vidios very well as david said.

On 07/11/2015, Tony via Jfw <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com> wrote:
I use IE and Firefox. Firefox is faster but gradually grabs memory
and cpu cycles, eventually crashing. This only happens when I have a
page open for a day or two and there are periodic updates from the site.

I'm considering Chrome.

Tony


-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Drew
Hunthausen via Jfw
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2015 10:12 AM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.'
Cc: Drew Hunthausen
Subject: RE: Chrome vs firefox

Thanks!! will give it a shot

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of dennis
via Jfw
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2015 8:01 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Cc: dennis
Subject: Re: Chrome vs firefox

firefox will cause you the least amount of ajustment woe. it works
just like IE for me.

On 11/7/2015 9:49 AM, Drew Hunthausen via Jfw wrote:
Dear list,

I'm a life time user of IE and due to the way many of the aspects of
my job and related software works have been advised to switch to
Chrome or
Firefox.
What is the learning curve in switching from IE, and is there
anything else I should be aware of. I haven't upgraded yet, but I do
have Jaws 17. Thanks so much

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--
Facebook: m.facebook.com/aidan.maher92
Skype: andries4451
Twitter: smarttalk7
Audioboo: www.audioboo.com/DjSpotlight

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Re: Outlook 2013.

Carolyn Arnold <4carolyna@...>
 

Thank you, Rex. I would think that they are pretty similar.

Bye for now,

Carolyn

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Rex Leslie
Howard, Jr. via Jfw
Sent: Saturday, November 7, 2015 3:54 PM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.' <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Cc: Rex Leslie Howard, Jr. <rex.howard@gmail.com>
Subject: RE: Outlook 2013.

I'll be right with you. I need to look at some keyboard shortcuts for
Outlook 2013. I use Outlook 2010 so I am not familiar with the exact
setup but I think what we may do is just reset your views altogether back
to default and see if that solve the issues.

There are just so many things it could be.

Let me do a little reading for five or ten and I'll try to get you a
solution.
-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Carolyn
Arnold via Jfw
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2015 2:46 PM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.'
Cc: Carolyn Arnold
Subject: RE: Outlook 2013.

Thank you. I have Outlook 2013. For some reason, since the system scan
done by Windows Defender yesterday, I can't get my incoming mail in my
Inbox to come in ascending order. Ascending is checked. I've had the
computer off, I've restarted it. I've cleared the Inbox then done
Alt-V-V-S, still Ascending is shown as checked. I'm perplexed.

I don't know anything about Skype, so if that is possible, I would need
your steering there.

Thank you for your attention to this.

If I don't get it resolved by next week, I'll call Microsoft Disability.

Bye for now,

Carolyn


-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Rex Leslie
Howard, Jr. via Jfw
Sent: Saturday, November 7, 2015 3:38 PM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.' <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Cc: Rex Leslie Howard, Jr. <rex.howard@gmail.com>
Subject: RE: Outlook 2013.

Has anyone answered your question yet. Are you using Microsoft Outlook or
another program. There are quite a few things that could be causing this.
I don't think any relate to Jaws specifically but it is frustrating I'm
sure. If you would like some help let me know and perhaps I can skype
with you and we can figure out what is going on.



-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Carolyn
Arnold via Jfw
Sent: Saturday, November 07, 2015 11:41 AM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.'
Cc: Carolyn Arnold
Subject: Outlook 2013.

Yesterday, we ran a full systems scan. Since that time, I noticed that
the e-mails in my Inbox, not my others, were in descending order. I went
in and checked back on ascending. Yet, they are still coming in
descending order.
Anyone have any idea how I can make it do my way, e-mails in ascending
order. I checked back, and ascending is checked.
Thanks for any ideas.



Best from,



Carolyn



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