On Sat, Aug 6, 2022 at 12:55 PM, Glenn / Lenny wrote:

-
And I have no idea how any of this is related to what I posted.

In the default "out of the box" state for JAWS, the mouse pointer/PC Cursor does not stay tethered to the JAWS cursor.  So your earlier statement that you thought the JAWS Cursor location was always where the mouse pointer was as well was incorrect.

Unless you use commands such as you've noted to change the default behavior, the mouse pointer doesn't really follow anything JAWS is doing, nor does the PC Cursor (and the two can be considered synonymous) in many instances.  They are disconnected from each other under many typical circumstances.  And so long as everything that needs to be accomplished can be done by keyboard commands alone, that doesn't often matter, but at times it really does matter.

That's precisely why there are commands to route the JAWS cursor to the PC Cursor location and the PC Cursor to the JAWS Cursor location so that the two are indeed co-located.

I'm not going to argue the point that the mouse pointer and the PC Cursor are synonymous as far as getting "click control" on something that allows it.  If you are on something in the JAWS cursor that requires a right or left click and it's an occasion where the PC cursor is not following the JAWS cursor, you have to route the PC Cursor to the JAWS cursor before issuing a click.

There are times, like when using File Explorer, where the JAWS Cursor and PC cursor are virtually always locked together just based on how that program works.  But there are lots of other instances where they are definitely not in lock step with each other and you need to route one to the other.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is complete.  If you’re alive, it isn’t.
     ~ Lauren Bacall

Mike,

I don't have JAWS on this machine at the moment, so I can't test directly right now.  What I really hope is now somewhere in JAWS is visible highlighting of what has focus in the virtual cursor but presented on the screen, tracking as the virtual cursor position changes.

I know that this sort of feature is of zero use for someone who cannot see, but when I need to collaborate with a screen reader user there is no other way I can know, with precision, what it is that the screen reader has focus on (or at least when we're talking controls, edit boxes, etc. - I can follow along when text is being read provided the screen scrolls when the last visible line of text is done and a "read all" is continuing).
--

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is complete.  If you’re alive, it isn’t.
     ~ Lauren Bacall

On Sat, Aug 6, 2022 at 12:55 PM, Glenn / Lenny wrote:

I've never set jaws cursor to follow the PC cursor, and I don't know
that my mouse is where the PC cursor is.
With control + insert + Jaws cursor key we can set the Jaws cursor
to stay with the PC cursor.
Shift instead of control will set it to follow the touch cursor, but
I rarely use the touch cursor, only when a program seems to be
otherwise inaccessible.

-
And I have no idea how any of this is related to what I posted.

In the default "out of the box" state for JAWS, the mouse pointer/PC
Cursor does not stay tethered to the JAWS cursor. So your earlier
statement that you thought the JAWS Cursor location was always where the
mouse pointer was as well was incorrect.

Unless you use commands such as you've noted to change the default
behavior, the mouse pointer doesn't really follow anything JAWS is
doing, nor does the PC Cursor (and the two can be considered synonymous)
in many instances. They are disconnected from each other under many
typical circumstances. And so long as everything that needs to be
accomplished can be done by keyboard commands alone, that doesn't often
matter, but at times it really does matter.

That's precisely why there are commands to route the JAWS cursor to the
PC Cursor location and the PC Cursor to the JAWS Cursor location so that
the two are indeed co-located.

I'm not going to argue the point that the mouse pointer and the PC
Cursor are synonymous as far as getting "click control" on something
that allows it. If you are on something in the JAWS cursor that
requires a right or left click and it's an occasion where the PC cursor
is not following the JAWS cursor, you have to route the PC Cursor to the
JAWS cursor before issuing a click.

There are times, like when using File Explorer, where the JAWS Cursor
and PC cursor are virtually always locked together just based on how
that program works. But there are lots of other instances where they
are definitely not in lock step with each other and you need to route
one to the other.

--

Brian -Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044

*Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is complete.
If you’re alive, it isn’t.
* ~ Lauren Bacall

On Sat, Aug 6, 2022 at 12:55 PM, Glenn / Lenny wrote:
I've never set jaws cursor to follow the PC cursor, and I don't know
that my mouse is where the PC cursor is.
With control + insert + Jaws cursor key we can set the Jaws cursor
to stay with the PC cursor.
Shift instead of control will set it to follow the touch cursor, but
I rarely use the touch cursor, only when a program seems to be
otherwise inaccessible.
-
And I have no idea how any of this is related to what I posted.
In the default "out of the box" state for JAWS, the mouse pointer/PC Cursor does not stay tethered to the JAWS cursor.  So your earlier statement that you thought the JAWS Cursor location was always where the mouse pointer was as well was incorrect.
Unless you use commands such as you've noted to change the default behavior, the mouse pointer doesn't really follow anything JAWS is doing, nor does the PC Cursor (and the two can be considered synonymous) in many instances.  They are disconnected from each other under many typical circumstances.  And so long as everything that needs to be accomplished can be done by keyboard commands alone, that doesn't often matter, but at times it really does matter.
That's precisely why there are commands to route the JAWS cursor to the PC Cursor location and the PC Cursor to the JAWS Cursor location so that the two are indeed co-located.
I'm not going to argue the point that the mouse pointer and the PC Cursor are synonymous as far as getting "click control" on something that allows it.  If you are on something in the JAWS cursor that requires a right or left click and it's an occasion where the PC cursor is not following the JAWS cursor, you have to route the PC Cursor to the JAWS cursor before issuing a click.
There are times, like when using File Explorer, where the JAWS Cursor and PC cursor are virtually always locked together just based on how that program works.  But there are lots of other instances where they are definitely not in lock step with each other and you need to route one to the other.
--
Brian -Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044
*Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is complete. If you’re alive, it isn’t.
*     ~ Lauren Bacall

I always thought the Jaws cursor location is always where the mouse pointer
is.

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is complete.  If you’re alive, it isn’t.
     ~ Lauren Bacall

On Sat, Aug 6, 2022 at 12:39 PM, Gene Warner wrote:
I need to do something like pass key through on a control, I have to
first do something to select the control before I do the pass key
through function.
-
The next time you have occasion for this to be necessary, would you mind posting about it?
I have needed to use and teach the pass-through key, but way over 9 times out of 10 it's being used because either the screen reader or one of its add-ons/scripts has "stolen" a keyboard shortcut from the application it's running over and you need to have the screen reader not react and just hand it to the application instead.
There is a finite number of keyboard shortcuts, and occasional clashes are inevitable.  And the hierarchy of processing for any keystokes is:
1. Windows itself.
2. Screen reader, if such is running
3. Application program
And once one level has processed, that keystroke is consumed and not passed further down the line.  And this is precisely why the pass-through command came into existence.
--
Brian -Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044
*Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is complete. If you’re alive, it isn’t.
*     ~ Lauren Bacall

I've never set jaws cursor to follow the PC cursor, and I don't know that my mouse is where the PC cursor is.

With control + insert + Jaws cursor key we can set the Jaws cursor to stay with the PC cursor.

Shift instead of control will set it to follow the touch cursor, but I rarely use the touch cursor, only when a program seems to be otherwise inaccessible.

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is complete.  If you’re alive, it isn’t.
     ~ Lauren Bacall

I always thought the Jaws cursor location is always where the mouse pointer
is.

Brian - Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044  

Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is complete.  If you’re alive, it isn’t.
     ~ Lauren Bacall

I always thought the Jaws cursor location is always where the mouse pointer
is.
Maybe this has changed over the years, but I know that in early Jaws, the
jaws cursor was the mouse cursor.
Glenn
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene Warner" <genewarner3@...>
To: <main@jfw.groups.io>
Sent: Saturday, August 06, 2022 11:30 AM
Subject: Re: preforming a right click
But even that has its drawbacks. I have a Microsoft Natural Ergonomic
Keyboard 4000 which has left and right mouse buttons below the space
bar. I rarely use them because the mouse pointer has to be over what you
want to click on and as far as I know the only way to do that is with a
real live mouse, trackball, touch pad, and etc. which are all a pain to
use even with mouse echo turned on.
There are key strokes to move one JAWS cursor to where another cursor
is, it would be nice if there was something like that for the mouse
pointer, or an option in JAWS to keep the mouse pointer with the
currently active JAWS cursor.
Gene...
On 8/6/2022 12:11 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:

On Sat, Aug 6, 2022 at 11:54 AM, Gene Warner wrote:

Unfortunately, I have yet to come across a situation where the JAWS
simulated mouse clicks actually helped. :-(

-
Which has also been my experience way more often than not. And not just
with JAWS, either. Hence the reason I encourage people to avoid the use
of emulated mouse button clicks when actual mouse button clicks without
mouse movement can be easily arranged. And right mouse click doesn't
even require arranging, as the Applications/Context Menu Key or SHIFT +
F10 is the functional equivalent and built in to Windows itself.
--

Brian -Windows 10, 64-Bit, Version 21H2, Build 19044

*Here is a test to find out whether your mission in life is complete.
If you’re alive, it isn’t.
* ~ Lauren Bacall