Moderated
Question about JAWS reinstall.
fenderwal@...
Hi, all. I may need to reformat or replace my HD. The version of JAWS I have is 18.07 because I want to use Window-Eyes until it absolutely won't work anymore.
During the JAWS reinstall, will the file I received when Freedom Scientific scrapped W-E and offered it free for W-E users require any kind of authentication code? Will I be forced during the installation to upgrade to the newest JFW, and, pay money I cannot spare at this time for an upgrade I don't really need?
Thanks in advance, Lou N. |
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Moderated
Re: Accessing panels within a web browser screen
Peter op t Hof <opthofp@...>
Mmm,
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As for Jira NVDA works better at the moment. Confluence is harder to access. Gr, Peter. Op 11-7-2019 om 05:49 schreef John Covici: I have used Jira, and found it difficult to use, I have not |
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Moderated
Re: Accessing panels within a web browser screen
John Covici
I have used Jira, and found it difficult to use, I have not
encountered panels, just lists which are hard to navigate. On Wed, 10 Jul 2019 22:47:30 -0400, Wideman, Donna J wrote: -- Your life is like a penny. You're going to lose it. The question is: How do you spend it? John Covici wb2una covici@... |
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Moderated
Accessing panels within a web browser screen
Wideman, Donna J
Does anyone use WhiteHat Sentinel, Jira or confluence?
There are often occasions where there are individual panels within a screen and I am trying to learn to access them.\ Any ideas? Thanks Donna ________________________________ CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed and may contain confidential and privileged information protected by law. If you received this e-mail in error, any review, use, dissemination, distribution, or copying of the e-mail is strictly prohibited. Please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete all copies from your system. |
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Moderated
After awhile links stop working in Wordpress using Firefox
Richard B. McDonald
Hi!
I am using JAWS 2019, Windows 7 and Firefox - all updated. When I am working in Wordpress (latest version, 5.2.2), After awhile links stop working. What I mean is, for example, in the admin menu (e.g., “Add New” (Plugin)), after I have been successfully clicking on (i.e., pressing “Enter”)various other links the links stop working. In this example, after awhile if I came to the “Add New” admin menu link and pressed “Enter” on it - it does not activate. Strangely, I do not ever seem to have this problem with the “Logout” link on the admin page. It never stops working.
Does anyone else have this issue? How can I fix it?
Thanks, Richard |
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Moderated
Re: IE 11 browser problem
JM Casey
I still use Firefox; it does not seem particularly bloated to me and there are many extensions for quantum versions, like uBlock Origin for instance, which I have installed. But, indeed, no webvism – which I never got to work anyway, on *any* version of Firefox – not to say that it doesn’t for some people, but it never solved a thing for me. Firefox’s biggest problem, for me, is that it now seems to struggle with large pages, even when those pages mostly contain text and links and practically nothing but. It’s still my preferred browser, though, and works great with most things. You’ll need a newer screen-reader though, definitely.
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gerald Levy via Groups.Io
Sent: July 4, 2019 6:34 AM To: main@jfw.groups.io Subject: Re: IE 11 browser problem
Chrome will not work with JAWS 15.?? The earliest version of JAWS that works with Chrome is JAWS 18.?? Same for the latest version of Firefox.?? It will not work with JAWS 15, either.?? I think the latest version of Firefox that works with JAWS 15 is Firefox 52 ESR, which is obsolete, although Webvisum still works with it.?? Therefore, in order to use the latest versions of Chrome and Firefox with JAWS, the best solution would be to purchase a one year license for JAWS 2019 for $90, or else switch to NVDA.?? Chrome is probably the best browser to use in most situations, although some web sites may still be more accessible with IE.?? Many users now avoid Firefox altogether, because it no longer allows third party extensions, and has become a bloated, screwed-up mess that is slow and prone to crashes and freezes.
Gerald
?? On 7/4/2019 12:16 AM, Jacob wrote:
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Moderated
Re: How to use external hard drive
JM Casey
Hi.
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JAWS doesn't really come into it. This is all Windows stuff, available to everyone. Usually you will find a new external drive is assigned a drive letter logically/alphabetically based on how many drives are already attached/a part of your system. That isn't *always* the case, I find, but it is 99% of the time. So, if you know you have just a system hard drive (usually given the letter c:) and that your DVD drive (if you have one) has the letter "d:", when you plug in your external drive, it should be assigned the letter "e:". I always have autoplay turned off, so nothing really appears to happen when I plug in a drive, but it will show up in "this PC" as mentioned right beneath this message. I can also open the run box with windows key + r and then type in the drive letter to open it. For example, my drive letters currently go up to "i:". If I plug in one of my other externals, it becomes "j:". So, I type windows key + r, then "j:" (don't forget the colon", enter, and the drive opens. From there, you can create folders, move files around, copy stuff, delete stuff -- just like you would any other drive. -----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Laura Richardson Sent: July 4, 2019 11:25 AM To: main@jfw.groups.io Subject: Re: How to use external hard drive Thank you for the input. I'm not a "power user" of Jaws but hopefully with the suggestions I've been given on this list I'll be able to figure it out. Laura -----Original Message----- From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of David & his pack of dogs Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 10:18 AM To: main@jfw.groups.io Subject: Re: How to use external hard drive I go into this computer then usually hit ctr. Then, the end key. That takes me to the bottom of the list where generally external devices are. Then as mentioned after opening it, paste the contents from the other source into the ext. drive. As with computers, there are many ways to do things, some are complicated and some are easy. I watched a video on something pertaining to computers and the way the person showed how to do it was very complicated and round about. I figured out a quicker and much less complicated. In other words, a straighter route rather then going around the bush to get there. -----Original Message----- From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Pat Byrne Sent: July 4, 2019 8:04 AM To: main@jfw.groups.io Subject: Re: How to use external hard drive Yes it would. Think of the hard drive as a mammoth thumb drive. PatAt 09:59 AM 7/4/2019, you wrote: When I place a thumb drive into my computer I have to go to filemanufacturer. So move what you want and you will have copies of what you transferred.computer.
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Moderated
Jaws does not read some menus
l. radical
Hello dear friends. I use a programm to recieve data from stock
exchange in my area. To activate the menus use the jaws cursor and in a point of the window i use the left click mouse emulation the key / and open the menu. After that using the pc cursor and the down arrow i read the menu itons. In some itons ther are submenus and using the right arow open and i am able to read them. How ever now i am using the jaws 2019 in windows 10 and i am note able to read anything using the pc cursor but using jaws cursor i read the menu itons but i can't activate non. Any help is welcome to solve this trouble. many thanks --Kostas-- |
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Moderated
Re: ltest version of jaws hangs on alt+tab to certan applications
Juan Hernandez
Hmm, weird. The issue I'm having only started on the latest June release of
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jaws 2019. I just installed the April version of jaws 2019, and the issue is gone. I'll report this to FS and see what they have to say. It is really annoying, and really slows down productivity. Best, Juan -----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Mario Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2019 7:49 AM To: main@jfw.groups.io Subject: Re: ltest version of jaws hangs on alt+tab to certan applications I realize you're talking about JAWS 2019, but I'm using JAWS 2018 on Windows 7 and notice that JAWS freezes momentarily after booting the computer and while navigating from one folder to another in Explorer. if I unload JAWS and restart in a few (about 10)seconds, navigation is snappy again. this freezing doesn't occur when NVDA is set to start at bootup instead of JAWS. ----- Original Message -------- From: Juan Hernandez [mailto:juanhernandez98@...] To: <main@jfw.groups.io> Date: Wednesday, July 10, 2019, 4:34 AM Subject: ltest version of jaws hangs on alt+tab to certan applications Hi All, I have noticed since this last version of jaws 2019.1906.10.400 there is about a 5 to 10 second hang where the entire computer locks up. It happens most when I alt+tab to a command prompt window, or a firefox/chrome web window. Have you guys seen this? If you have have you discovered a fix? Best, Juan |
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Moderated
Re: ltest version of jaws hangs on alt+tab to certan applications
Mario
I realize you're talking about JAWS 2019, but I'm using JAWS 2018 on
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Windows 7 and notice that JAWS freezes momentarily after booting the computer and while navigating from one folder to another in Explorer. if I unload JAWS and restart in a few (about 10)seconds, navigation is snappy again. this freezing doesn't occur when NVDA is set to start at bootup instead of JAWS. ----- Original Message --------
From: Juan Hernandez [mailto:juanhernandez98@...] To: <main@jfw.groups.io> Date: Wednesday, July 10, 2019, 4:34 AM Subject: ltest version of jaws hangs on alt+tab to certan applications Hi All, I have noticed since this last version of jaws 2019.1906.10.400 there is about a 5 to 10 second hang where the entire computer locks up. It happens most when I alt+tab to a command prompt window, or a firefox/chrome web window. Have you guys seen this? If you have have you discovered a fix? Best, Juan |
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Moderated
ltest version of jaws hangs on alt+tab to certan applications
Juan Hernandez
Hi All,
I have noticed since this last version of jaws 2019.1906.10.400 there is about a 5 to 10 second hang where the entire computer locks up. It happens most when I alt+tab to a command prompt window, or a firefox/chrome web window.
Have you guys seen this? If you have have you discovered a fix?
Best,
Juan |
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Moderated
Re: Working with Itunes
Brian Blair <brianblair@...>
There was an Itunes script called Blind Tunes but the website https://doitblind.com/ where this used to be found no longer has it. I doubt the old Blind Tunes scripts would work with the newest Itunes. Wish something could make Itunes more user friendly on Windows.
Brian On 7/8/2019 12:39 PM, Jay wrote:
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Moderated
Re: having an issue where when i use krome it just says blank
David Kingsbury
Be sure the window is maximized (Hit Windows and Up arrow) to do this.
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Moderated
COMS AT certification
Rob Whyte <rob.whyte@...>
Good day, Does anyone have any info about COMS AT certification. I work as an AT specialist but have not come across this as yet.
Cheers Rob
Rob Whyte Assistive Technology | Specialist Services | VisAbility Work days Mondays and Tuesdays JAWS 2018 certified PO Box 82 North Hobart TAS 7002 62 Invermay Road, Launceston TAS 7248 164 Elizabeth Street, Hobart TAS 7000
T: 03 6232 1248 | F: 03 6232 1221 M: 0429 366 589
We are here to share stories, to change perspectives. Sign up to receive our eNewsletter here:
Message protected by MailGuard: e-mail anti-virus, anti-spam and content filtering. |
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Moderated
Re: best web browser to use with JAWS?
Randy Barnett <blindmansbluff09@...>
Artificial benchmarks mean nothing in the real world... How a app performs on your system is what matters. My connection is 100MBs and IE is not slow in general. there are of course times when the site or internet is slow for a certain website but in general I don't see much difference in my web experience. IE will crash more than Chrome but that is a coding issue IE has with modern sites. MS is still adding support to IE so it is still viable when Chromium Edge doesn't do what I need.
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Bottom line is we need IE, Chromium and other web browsers to get the most out of the internet. smiley face On 7/7/2019 5:07 AM, Sieghard Weitzel wrote:
I don't think how fast IE is has anything to do with how fast your system is. It may have a bit to do with whether you have a 6 Mbps down/1 Mbps up ADSL connection or a 250 MBPS down/50 MBPS up fiber connection, but believe me, I also have some relatively fast systems and I have older slower ones and IE is equally slow on all of them. When they talk about fast web browsers and do tests where they set whatever benchmarks are being used I am sure there is a reason why Chrome is always performing much higher than IE or why, for that matter, pretty much most modern chromium based browsers do. |
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Moderated
Working with Itunes
Jay
Hi all.
I remember back in the day there was an app, or jaws script that allowed us to work with iTunes. Does this script still exist, and where can I find it? It feels like the latest version of iTunes isn't real accessible. It's accessible as far as reading everything goes, but the layout interface needs some work. Thanks in advance |
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Moderated
Re: What choice do I use to get a Focus Blue paired so it works with JAWS?
Michael Mote
Hi Kevin. Have you tried to remove the dongle Bluetooth device from the computer through the device manager? I wonder if it is showing up there? Also, have you installed the latest Windows updates? That may help you as well.
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Kevin Minor
Sent: Monday, July 8, 2019 3:59 PM To: main@jfw.groups.io Subject: Re: What choice do I use to get a Focus Blue paired so it works with JAWS?
Hi Michael.
I agree that this process of pairing devices in Windows 10 SHOULD be simple enough, but it isn’t working, which is why I installed the software drivers for the dongle. I’m using the latest version of both JAWS and Windows 10, and I’m doing what was working before. I hit INSERT+I to get into settings, then I search for Blue until the Bluetooth settings appear. I then hit that. Now, here’s where the problem is. Shouldn’t there be an option where you can turn Bluetooth on and off? Well, it was there in Windows for me with the dongle, but it’s not there anymore. I do know the dongle works, and I can pair it with my iPhone through the software for the CSR dongle. I think that what I need to do is somehow get Windows to think the dongle is totally gone, unplug it, plug it back in, and then let Windows reload the native drivers it has. The instructions for the dongle indicate this should work, and indeed it did before, but it isn’t working now. What in the world do I do? I called up Microsoft Disability about this twice. One time we got it working, but when it failed again, we couldn’t get it working, and the problem was supposedly escalated, but I haven’t heard from them about it. Anybody know what I can do to fix this, short of either reformatting the drive and installing Windows again, but this old laptop has seen its better days, so I’m hoping to avoid that. It’s either that, or I throw the whole thing through what the OS is named for, but then I couldn’t use it with the Focus, so I don’t think that’s a good idea either. I’m sure the solution is really simple, but I just don’t know what it is.
Thanks, Michael, for your thoughts, and if anybody else has any ideas, they would be very much appreciated.
Kevin and Jilly
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Michael Mote
Hi Kevin. If you are running windows 10, you should be able to add the Focus fairly easily. I've done this with several braille displays in the past. You will first need to access your settings by pressing Windows plus the letter I. Then, under the devices category, select bluetooth and other devices. Once you have that selected, tab over to the add blue tooth device. A list should display, and the focus should show up. Press enter on it, and Windows should do the rest. Then, you will have to set up your display in JAWS, and make sure JAWS is pointing at the correct device. You will set up your display under the Synthesizer and braille options in JAWS. Follow the steps there, and it should work for you.
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Hi.
I will very soon be the proud owner of a Focus 40 Blue display, but I have a really simple question about it, and it deals with pairing it so it works over Bluetooth. I had to get a Bluetooth dongle for my Windows 10 laptop, because the one in it is broke. I can’t get Windows to pair with other devices through it like the instructions claim, so I installed the drivers that came with the dongle. I now have this nice piece of software with the CSR dongle, but I’m not quite sure what to do from here. My question is, what kind of a device is the Focus? I have several options to choose from, such as a phone and headphones, but they’re not what I want. I have three choices to select from, but I don’t know which one to use. They are: Keyboard, Computer, and All. Now, just which one do I use? I’d try Keyboard, but I don’t know if that’s good enough, because JAWS sends data to the display to read. I think Computer is overkill, so I don’t think it’s that one either. All might be what I want, but I’m not really familiar with using Bluetooth. Can someone give me some help? I’m asking here, because if I want to use the Focus over Bluetooth with JAWS, I need to get this working, but I’m a newbie at this. Once I learn, I’ll be more than happy to pay the kindness forward for someone else out there.
Thanks in advance for the help, and if things really work out well, I might have one of these neat things in my grubby little hands next week. There’s a good and bad side to that, though. The good side is I’ll have it. The bad side is if I get it now, my financial advisor, also known as Mom will kill me for doing it, so I won’t get to use it. Even worse, I probably wouldn’t even be buried with it because she’d send it back. All kidding aside, Mom has my best interest at heart, and she might holler a bit, but I’ll deal with it and go on from there.
Have a great day and don’t work too hard. Kevin and Jilly |
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Moderated
Re: What choice do I use to get a Focus Blue paired so it works with JAWS?
Kevin Minor
Hi Michael.
I agree that this process of pairing devices in Windows 10 SHOULD be simple enough, but it isn’t working, which is why I installed the software drivers for the dongle. I’m using the latest version of both JAWS and Windows 10, and I’m doing what was working before. I hit INSERT+I to get into settings, then I search for Blue until the Bluetooth settings appear. I then hit that. Now, here’s where the problem is. Shouldn’t there be an option where you can turn Bluetooth on and off? Well, it was there in Windows for me with the dongle, but it’s not there anymore. I do know the dongle works, and I can pair it with my iPhone through the software for the CSR dongle. I think that what I need to do is somehow get Windows to think the dongle is totally gone, unplug it, plug it back in, and then let Windows reload the native drivers it has. The instructions for the dongle indicate this should work, and indeed it did before, but it isn’t working now. What in the world do I do? I called up Microsoft Disability about this twice. One time we got it working, but when it failed again, we couldn’t get it working, and the problem was supposedly escalated, but I haven’t heard from them about it. Anybody know what I can do to fix this, short of either reformatting the drive and installing Windows again, but this old laptop has seen its better days, so I’m hoping to avoid that. It’s either that, or I throw the whole thing through what the OS is named for, but then I couldn’t use it with the Focus, so I don’t think that’s a good idea either. I’m sure the solution is really simple, but I just don’t know what it is.
Thanks, Michael, for your thoughts, and if anybody else has any ideas, they would be very much appreciated.
Kevin and Jilly
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of
Michael Mote
Sent: Monday, July 8, 2019 3:06 PM To: main@jfw.groups.io Subject: Re: What choice do I use to get a Focus Blue paired so it works with JAWS?
Hi Kevin. If you are running windows 10, you should be able to add the Focus fairly easily. I've done this with several braille displays in the past. You will first need to access your settings by pressing Windows plus the letter I. Then, under the devices category, select bluetooth and other devices. Once you have that selected, tab over to the add blue tooth device. A list should display, and the focus should show up. Press enter on it, and Windows should do the rest. Then, you will have to set up your display in JAWS, and make sure JAWS is pointing at the correct device. You will set up your display under the Synthesizer and braille options in JAWS. Follow the steps there, and it should work for you.
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Hi.
I will very soon be the proud owner of a Focus 40 Blue display, but I have a really simple question about it, and it deals with pairing it so it works over Bluetooth. I had to get a Bluetooth dongle for my Windows 10 laptop, because the one in it is broke. I can’t get Windows to pair with other devices through it like the instructions claim, so I installed the drivers that came with the dongle. I now have this nice piece of software with the CSR dongle, but I’m not quite sure what to do from here. My question is, what kind of a device is the Focus? I have several options to choose from, such as a phone and headphones, but they’re not what I want. I have three choices to select from, but I don’t know which one to use. They are: Keyboard, Computer, and All. Now, just which one do I use? I’d try Keyboard, but I don’t know if that’s good enough, because JAWS sends data to the display to read. I think Computer is overkill, so I don’t think it’s that one either. All might be what I want, but I’m not really familiar with using Bluetooth. Can someone give me some help? I’m asking here, because if I want to use the Focus over Bluetooth with JAWS, I need to get this working, but I’m a newbie at this. Once I learn, I’ll be more than happy to pay the kindness forward for someone else out there.
Thanks in advance for the help, and if things really work out well, I might have one of these neat things in my grubby little hands next week. There’s a good and bad side to that, though. The good side is I’ll have it. The bad side is if I get it now, my financial advisor, also known as Mom will kill me for doing it, so I won’t get to use it. Even worse, I probably wouldn’t even be buried with it because she’d send it back. All kidding aside, Mom has my best interest at heart, and she might holler a bit, but I’ll deal with it and go on from there.
Have a great day and don’t work too hard. Kevin and Jilly |
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Moderated
Re: What choice do I use to get a Focus Blue paired so it works with JAWS?
Michael Mote
Hi Kevin. If you are running windows 10, you should be able to add the Focus fairly easily. I've done this with several braille displays in the past. You will first need to access your settings by pressing Windows plus the letter I. Then, under the devices category, select bluetooth and other devices. Once you have that selected, tab over to the add blue tooth device. A list should display, and the focus should show up. Press enter on it, and Windows should do the rest. Then, you will have to set up your display in JAWS, and make sure JAWS is pointing at the correct device. You will set up your display under the Synthesizer and braille options in JAWS. Follow the steps there, and it should work for you.
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Hi.
I will very soon be the proud owner of a Focus 40 Blue display, but I have a really simple question about it, and it deals with pairing it so it works over Bluetooth. I had to get a Bluetooth dongle for my Windows 10 laptop, because the one in it is broke. I can’t get Windows to pair with other devices through it like the instructions claim, so I installed the drivers that came with the dongle. I now have this nice piece of software with the CSR dongle, but I’m not quite sure what to do from here. My question is, what kind of a device is the Focus? I have several options to choose from, such as a phone and headphones, but they’re not what I want. I have three choices to select from, but I don’t know which one to use. They are: Keyboard, Computer, and All. Now, just which one do I use? I’d try Keyboard, but I don’t know if that’s good enough, because JAWS sends data to the display to read. I think Computer is overkill, so I don’t think it’s that one either. All might be what I want, but I’m not really familiar with using Bluetooth. Can someone give me some help? I’m asking here, because if I want to use the Focus over Bluetooth with JAWS, I need to get this working, but I’m a newbie at this. Once I learn, I’ll be more than happy to pay the kindness forward for someone else out there.
Thanks in advance for the help, and if things really work out well, I might have one of these neat things in my grubby little hands next week. There’s a good and bad side to that, though. The good side is I’ll have it. The bad side is if I get it now, my financial advisor, also known as Mom will kill me for doing it, so I won’t get to use it. Even worse, I probably wouldn’t even be buried with it because she’d send it back. All kidding aside, Mom has my best interest at heart, and she might holler a bit, but I’ll deal with it and go on from there.
Have a great day and don’t work too hard. Kevin and Jilly |
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Moderated
Re: having an issue where when i use krome it just says blank
Larry Wayland
I am having the same problem with Jaws 19, and Windows v 1803. I have found
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that giving the computer a little more time to settle in, after booting seems to help. -----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io [mailto:main@jfw.groups.io] On Behalf Of Cristóbal Sent: Monday, July 8, 2019 11:44 AM To: main@jfw.groups.io Subject: Re: having an issue where when i use krome it just says blank I've found that maximizing the screen to get Jaws back into focus usually does the trick. This way too, I am able to keep my place. If I tab or shift tab, Focus will come back, but I'll usually be placed at the top of the screen which is a major annoyance. Regardless, yes, it is a pain. Also, I've encountered this behavior with earlier versions of Jaws and before the 1903 update. -----Original Message----- From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Mike Rogers Sent: Monday, July 8, 2019 8:30 AM To: main@jfw.groups.io Subject: Re: having an issue where when i use krome it just says blank This happens to me frequently. If I go out of J19 and use NVDA to get to the site, then go back to J19, everything is fine after that. Pain in the neck and elsewhere. Doesn't happen all the time, but enough to be an annoyance. ******************************** www.harmonicaworkshops.com On Sun, 7 Jul 2019 10:29:00 -0600 "james hooper" <rockiesfan296@...> wrote: So that is the problem, when I try using Krome with the latest jaws 2019and windows 1903 when I open a web page with krome it just says blank, any thoughts. is. It may have a bit to do with whether you have a 6 Mbps down/1 Mbps up ADSL connection or a 250 MBPS down/50 MBPS up fiber connection, but believe me, I also have some relatively fast systems and I have older slower ones and IE is equally slow on all of them. When they talk about fast web browsers and do tests where they set whatever benchmarks are being used I am sure there is a reason why Chrome is always performing much higher than IE or why, for that matter, pretty much most modern chromium based browsers do. (extremely rare now) is how slow it is. that frustrates me, I got back to ol' IE. what you need them too. The truth is you need multiple browsers because each will work in a situation where the others wont. the new Chromium based Edge is pretty good. I use it as my default browser and use IE and Firefox on occasion. There will never be a single work on every webpage browser for us. water fox or Brave but I will be after reading this. browser to use with the latest version of JAWS. I seem to go back and forth on this and would like to settle down and really learn using what folks think is best.
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