Date   

moderated trouble checking in for a doctor's appointment

Shirley Tracy
 

Hi all,

 

I’m seeing a new doctor, and the office insists I check in before my appointment. I have tried answering all the questions in the check-in page, but when I got to the question for me to verify my street address, I don’t see how to select the correct one—as there is no instruction. I tried simply selecting the same as I would something I wanted to copy, but it doesn’t seem to work. And when I click the button to confirm, I get the message that I have not selected my address. Help!

 

What do I do?

 

And yes, I know I’m not good with technology—but at least I’m trying—and I did try to find written information.

 

Thanks for your help.

Cheerfully,

 

Shirley Tracy


moderated Re: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

Cristóbal
 

Yes I always download the file instead of using the update wizard.

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Richard Turner
Sent: Friday, May 21, 2021 7:53 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

 

I am running the May update to Jaws 2021 and the Windows Clipboard is working the way it always had for me.

Jaws is reading the entries after I hit Windows+v and I can arrow to the one I want to paste and hit enter, and it is pasted.

 

I don’t know if you do your updates this way, but I always download the package and install, rather than going through the update wizard because I think the wizard’s wand is damaged.

 

 

 

 

Richard

"The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, but what they become by it."

- John Ruskin, 1819-1900

 

Web site: www.turner42.com

 

 

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Cristóbal
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 7:38 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

 

Just tried it. Didn’t work.

Thanks anyway.

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris Hill
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 5:16 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

 

This is a feature i just turned on.  I had no luck getting jaws to read it (current version recently updated).  Then I reloaded jaws, problem solved.  I suspect that jaws loading on startup may be causing the problem, just unload and reload it.

 

 

On 5/20/2021 18:58, Cristóbal wrote:

Or… I could ask the list community if there’s perhaps an alternative clipboard utility that’s accessible with Jaws I could use in the meantime without having to jump through all those impractical hoops.

I’ve tried Ditto and ClipAngel so far. I already mentioned Ditto previously. ClipAngel seems like a nifty little tool, but while the menus are accessible, I can’t seem to find any of the copied text entries. So it’s basically a no go.

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Glenn / Lenny
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 4:52 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

 

Well you could unload your licensed copy, and load the demo when need be and unload that and go back to the licensed copy.

Of course the time limit keeps going so you'd have to reboot after 40 minutes.

But it's better than nothing.

 

----- Original Message -----

From: Cristóbal

Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 6:47 PM

Subject: Re: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

 

Not practical in the least.

While I do use NVDA for the odd task her and there, Jaws is my primary screen reader and how I run my business. Outlook, Excel, Word etc. Hence my asking about Jaws to begin with…

Running JFW in demo mode throughout the day would be terribly disruptive as well.

This is why I specifically asked about an alternative application while this hopefully gets fixed.

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Glenn / Lenny
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 4:44 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

 

Maybe download the Jaws 2020 and if you cannot license it, run it as a demo.

Or you could install NVDA.

 

Glenn

----- Original Message -----

From: Cristóbal

Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 6:40 PM

Subject: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

 

Hello list,

So it seems like the May 2021 Jaws update broke the Windows clipboard. Broke in the sense that while the clipboard itself still works, Jaws isn’t speaking the various copied entries when arrowing around which is causing me all sorts of fits.

This actually happened a couple of months ago and at that time, I simply rolled back to the prior version of Jaws. Vispero did put out a new update which fixed the problem and that’s what I attempted to do this time, but even after rolling back to the April 2021 Jaws where the clipboard worked before installing the May 2021 update, now it seems that not even the April Jaws update is working right with the clipboard.

So anyway, I don’t have time for Vispero to investigate the issue and hopefully do something to fix this bug. In the meantime, I need to access this particular feature for my work. Is there an alternative Windows 10 clipboard utility that I can use? I tried downloading Ditto, but as it’s an extension to the Windows 10 clipboard itself, no luck there.

Thanks,

Cristóbal

 


moderated Re: IE being removed from Win 10 20H2 and later, effective June 15th 2022

 

On Fri, May 21, 2021 at 11:51 AM, Sieghard Weitzel wrote:
Yes, and every year thousands of people fall for one scam or another and you really wonder how this can happen given how often such things get mentioned in the newspapers and online.

And, at least in my area, on the local TV news, particularly when a specific scam seems to be "making the rounds" in the area.

I have become convinced that some people are utterly clueless and others have a limited capacity of what they can store in their heads and for which they have "easy retrieval access in the wetware."  And I am intentionally ignoring cognitive impairments, which are a thing of their own.  I'm talking strictly about the great masses that are within the first standard deviation to 1.5 standard deviations of the whole population who are neurotypical.

I haven't seen or heard of a scam that doesn't have an entirely familiar form in many years now.  And I'm including phone scams, "Nigerian Prince Type" email scams, I'm in trouble can you send me money scams, etc., etc., etc.   They've all made the rounds, many times, and been reported on many times with the entirely predictable results.  It amazes me that those getting sucked into these things these days don't seem to have even the slightest warning bell go off when something so familiar, well-publicized in the popular press, and virtually identical in form lands in their laps.  It's as though they're completely blank slates.

And it's not just the unsophisticated and uneducated.  Very recently an acquaintance of mine who was a practicing veterinarian for decades and taught vet tech courses at the local community college for decades after that fell for the oldie-but-goodie pop-up saying, "You've got an infected system, call {insert scammers number here}," and for some ungodly reason, he did.  Luckily, he almost instantly had the nagging feeling he shouldn't have done this, and called me.  I told him to call the credit card company and immediately stop payment on the $300 he'd authorized (it hadn't yet posted, and they closed his account and issued a new card) and to shut the computer down immediately and do not use it again, for anything, until a "nuke and pave" or a restore from a full system image backup taken before the incident was done.  In the end he went the "nuke and pave" route of a completely clean reinstall of Windows 10.

No legitimate tech company will ever cold-call you or ever display a pop-up in your web browser saying you're infected.  It really is that simple.  Hang up or close that window/shut down the machine immediately.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042  

It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not.

           ~ André Gide


moderated Re: IE being removed from Win 10 20H2 and later, effective June 15th 2022

 

If said computer is so unimportant and cheap and you have so many others like it then why not simply stick with Windows 7 on it, then you have iE and you don't have to worry about updates.

----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of James English
Sent: Friday, May 21, 2021 7:52 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: IE being removed from Win 10 20H2 and later, effective June 15th 2022

That would be great if I used this computer for anything but browsing the web and a bit of media playback. It's the one that I travel around with, because it's light and cheap and contains no information that I don't have either on another computer or stored on my file server or in the cloud. If, when I travel away for the weekend next week I left the computer on the train, I would have another one, with all the data from this one, available when I get home. The computer doesn't hold any bank information, credit card information or information that would let a stranger find me. This being the case there is no point talking about the security implications of stopping updates to preserve IE, or of continuing to use it as I have covered all the bases.

So if you know a way of disabling windows updates, I would be very happy to know despite the damage that could be done to the computer I don't care about or the data that's backed up.

- James

On 5/21/21, Brian Vogel <britechguy@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, May 21, 2021 at 10:19 AM, James English wrote:


Is there something you fear happening to this cheap throwaway
computer that is so terrible? I believe it's possible to stop updates
in windows
10
by disabling the update service, is this no longer the case?
-
I have zero concerns about anything happening to the computer that
could not be reversed, at least as far as having a running computer
goes.  Nor do most who are issuing warnings.  What we worry about is
loss of data, often years worth of data, and often containing things
like family photos, massive music libraries where the source material
is no longer available, etc., etc., etc.    If you do a full system
image backup and separate user backups routinely you come as close to
completely eliminating your exposure on those counts entirely.

I will not discuss any hacks that can be done to prevent any operating
system from receiving updates.  Of course these exist.  The people who
created these OSes in the first place and who are the ones maintaining
them are in the very best position to know what updates are necessary, and why.
No one has ever put it better than John Carrona, a BSOD (Blue Screen
of
Death) expert, now retired due to health issues, and who was in a far
better position to speak definitively about this than I could ever hope to be:

There really isn't a point to checking for updates and not installing them.
. .  It's important to install *all* available updates. I've been
doing this since the days of DOS, and I still don't have the
confidence to pick and choose among updates.  There are just too many
variables involved - and most people can't evaluate the full
consequences of installing/not installing updates.

~ John Carrona, AKA *usasma (
https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/u/35824/usasma/ )* on
BleepingComputer.com, http://www.carrona.org/ (
http://www.carrona.org/ )

If someone with his depth of expertise feels that he could not
reliably, "evaluate the full consequences of intsalling/not installing
updates," nor feel confident that he could possibly know all the
variables involved in the need for them . . .
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042

*It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what
you are
not.*

~ André Gide






moderated Re: IE being removed from Win 10 20H2 and later, effective June 15th 2022

 

Yes,, and every year thousands of people fall for one scam or another and you really wonder how this can happen given how often such things get mentioned in the newspapers and online. Just read in our little local newspaper (I live in a town of 6,000 in fairly remote Northwestern British Columbia) that our RCMP detachment here received a fraud complaint. The person who I assume was from here received a phone call. The caller said he was a lawyer from Vancouver and he was representing the guy's son. According to him the son had been involved in a car accident and since he was drunk he was now in jail and a $5,000 bail payment was required for him to get out. Then apparently a second guy was patched in who claimed to be the son and who crying and begging asked for the help. How a father won't recognize his own son I don't know, but even without that I am baffled how somebody could fall for this and apparently the victim here send two $5,000 payments to the specified bank account.

 

Best regards,

Sieghard

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Brian Vogel
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 2:35 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: IE being removed from Win 10 20H2 and later, effective June 15th 2022

 

On Thu, May 20, 2021 at 05:24 PM, Bill White wrote:

Colonial Pipeline

-
If, and I emphasize if, they were still using Windows 7 that's huge mistake number one, at least if they're not one of the companies forking out the big bucks to Microsoft to do ongoing support by custom contract.  There are a few that did this, and it's costing them a king's ransom, as it should.

But, even if that's the case, they also have no excuse for not having a robust backup plan in place.  Ransomware is useless if you have your systems backed up on a cycle that's as frequent as needed based on your exact business circumstances (mostly related to the generation of new information, e.g., orders).  Recovery from backups should be an hours to maybe day long process, at most, and if you do what Colonial said it did, and that was electively shutting down large segments of its network to prevent spread, you should know precisely where those backups need to be recovered to versus "safe zones."

If you're paying ransom, something's very, very wrong.  No business of any size should ever be in a position where a ransomware attack should result in the payment of ransom.  No government should, either.  Both private and public sector entities have been caught with their pants down, and you'd think by now that the cautionary lessons from same would have been learned.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042  

It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not.

           ~ André Gide


moderated Re: IE being removed from Win 10 20H2 and later, effective June 15th 2022

 

And as I think it was pointed out in the article, Edge has an IE mode for old websites. In any case, if IE actually goes away for good and somebody who hasn't updated their website to a newer standard they will surely do so fairly quickly if they still want people to use it.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of James English
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 5:42 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: IE being removed from Win 10 20H2 and later, effective June 15th 2022

So the problem I have is exclusively with IE being removed from users pcs. I am, at present, the owner of 28 computers that can run the present copy of windows 10. If one of them gets messed up because of ransomwear or some form of virus Norton hasn't picked up I can chuck it away, open reserve laptop and continue to be fine. For me, it's a case of whether I want to abandon the websites I've been using in IE for ages, kill Microsoft updates, or write my own webbrowser. Right now I'm thinking that stopping Microsoft updates is the best plan.

On 5/21/21, Brian Vogel <britechguy@gmail.com> wrote:
On Thu, May 20, 2021 at 08:22 PM, Mario wrote:


so this is for next year, no?
-
Correct.  All Windows 10 users of the common versions (Home and Pro)
have been given a one-year heads-up about what's coming so they can
transition with grace and not need to panic.

--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042

*It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what
you are
not.*

~ André Gide






moderated Re: IE being removed from Win 10 20H2 and later, effective June 15th 2022

 

On Thu, May 20, 2021 at 08:42 PM, James English wrote:
For me, it's a case of whether I want to abandon the websites I've been using in IE for ages
-
You, and anyone else in this situation, also owe it to themselves to try Edge in IE-mode.  See:  What is Internet Explorer mode? | Microsoft Docs

And, yes, it's a PITA to configure for specific sites, and if you have Win10 Home you won't have Group Policy editor.  But it should be a PITA to configure for specific sites, as those sites should have updated long, long ago.  But if you're still needing to access a site that has been abandoned for years as far as any updating goes, and that uses soon-to-be-defunct code that is tightly bound to the IE era, Microsoft is giving a mechanism to do that in Edge itself.  But it's not automatic, it must be configured on a site-by-site basis.
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042  

It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not.

           ~ André Gide


moderated Re: May Update for, JAWS2021, Build 2105.53, Download Link + What's New

 

It works fine here

 

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of John Gurd via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 11:41 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: May Update for, JAWS2021, Build 2105.53, Download Link + What's New

 

The email thread keyboard commands don’t work for me. I’m assuming it’s because I’ve customised all my email groups into threads via View Settings rather than the standard thread button. Is it working for othrs?

 

John

 

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Cristóbal
Sent: 19 May 2021 19:41
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: May Update for, JAWS2021, Build 2105.53, Download Link + What's New

 

Seems like a fairly significant update.

Hopefully the email thread thing gets more attention.

 

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Mike B
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2021 10:48 AM
To: JList <main@jfw.groups.io>
Subject: May Update for, JAWS2021, Build 2105.53, Download Link + What's New

 

Hi All,

 

Below is the direct download link for the May J2021 build, 2105.53, update + what's new in this release.

 

32 & 64 Bit Download Link:

 

 

What's New:

 

Enhancements in JAWS 2021.2105.53 (May 2021)

 

The following is a list of improvements made between the April 2021 release and the May 2021 update.

 

Easier Navigation Through Email Threads in Outlook

 

It is quite common, particularly in a work or school environment, for email messages to include several people, resulting in lengthy message threads as
participants reply and add to the conversation. When opening an email that contains a thread of messages, including replies or forwards, it can be time
consuming to read through the thread with JAWS or Fusion using the ARROW keys to locate particular responses as you need to move through all of the header
information for each message.

 

To make this easier, you can now use the N or SHIFT+N Navigation Quick Keys to quickly move to and place focus at the beginning of the next or previous
message in an open email thread, skipping over all of the header information. As you navigate with these commands, JAWS and Fusion reads who the message
is from, the date it was sent, and the first line. If you determine this is not the message in the thread you were looking for, continue using N or SHIFT+N
until you reach the message you want. While reading a particular message in the thread, pressing ALT+1 or ALT+2 now announces the sender or date  of the
message at your current location. To review sender and date info for the entire email, press CTRL+HOME to move back to the top before pressing ALT+1 or
ALT+2.

 

For users of the Focus braille display, you can set a NAV rocker to move through messages in an open email thread. While focused in an email, press the
NAV Mode button above the NAV rocker you want to set to cycle through the available navigation modes until "Message" is selected. If you are using an older
Focus display that includes Wiz Wheels, press down on the wheel to select the mode. If focus moves away from the message, the navigation mode defaults
back to Line.

 

Note: Currently, this feature is only available while reading an email and not when editing a message. Additionally, while currently limited to messages
containing replies and forwards from Outlook, we will continue to improve this feature over time to support emails from other sources like Gmail and iOS.

 

Voice Assistant Improvements

 

In the initial 2021 release, we introduced Voice Assistant, a new way to interact with JAWS in Windows 10. Voice Assistant offers a convenient option for
quickly performing various JAWS commands using natural speech instead of memorizing specific keystrokes. Since its introduction, we have received numerous
requests from customers wanting to be able to access more JAWS features by voice in order to increase productivity.

 

Some JAWS features you can now access by using voice commands include:

 

list of 16 items
• Selecting Text, especially blocks of text, has never been easier. Just locate the spot where you wish to begin selecting and say "Hey Sharky, Start Selection."
Then navigate to the location where selection should end and say "Hey Sharky, Finish Selection." You did it! At that point, all text between the two locations
will be highlighted. You can confirm using the SHIFT+INSERT+DOWN ARROW Command to verify you got it all. This works on Web Pages, in Documents, and even
in Emails.
• Working with the JAWS speech history without remembering any keystrokes is now even easier. Try any of the following:
list of 3 items nesting level 1
• "Hey Sharky, Show Speech History"
• "Hey Sharky, Copy Speech History to Clipboard"
• "Hey Sharky, Clear Speech History"
list end nesting level 1
• Working with Technical Support just got easier. Have you ever been asked to get the version information for your software or operating system? Try this
out:
list of 2 items nesting level 1
• "Hey Sharky, Virtualize Version Info"
• "Hey Sharky, Copy Version Info to Clipboard"
list end nesting level 1
• You can now ask JAWS to help virtualize a control or window, or even copy them directly to the Clipboard. For example, go to the JAWS About dialog box,
and try the following:
list of 4 items nesting level 1
• "Hey Sharky, Virtualize Window"
• "Hey Sharky, Copy Window"
• "Hey Sharky, Virtualize Control"
• "Hey Sharky, Copy Control"
list end nesting level 1
• When navigating Word documents and Outlook messages, you can use Voice Assistant to work with various elements like headings, tables, and graphics. Try
the following:
list of 3 items nesting level 1
• "Hey Sharky, List Headings"
• "Hey Sharky, Next Table"
• "Hey Sharky, Next Graphic"
list end nesting level 1
• When editing a Word document or Outlook message, you can use Voice Assistant to move to Spelling or Grammatical errors. For Example, try:
list of 2 items nesting level 1
• "Hey Sharky, Next Spelling Error"
• "Hey Sharky, Next Grammatical Error"
list end nesting level 1
• While reading a message in Outlook containing several replies or forwards, you can now say "Hey Sharky, Next Message" or "Previous Message." You will
skip the headings and get right to the various replies within that email.
• When focused on math content in Word that you wish to navigate, you can now say "Hey Sharky, Math Viewer." This opens the JAWS Math Viewer where you
can explore the current equation.
• To edit a math equation using the new Braille Math Editor, move to the equation and say "Hey Sharky, Math Editor."
• Toggle the Braille or Text Viewers on or off by saying "Hey Sharky, Braille Viewer" or "Text Viewer."
• Start or stop a JAWS Tandem session by saying "Hey Sharky, Tandem."
• Open the Select a Voice Profile dialog box by saying "Hey Sharky, Voice Profile."
• To access something in the System Tray, try saying "Hey Sharky, System Tray."
• Speak the most recent Windows notification by saying "Hey Sharky, Notification."
• If you have a laptop and want to know the charge level of its battery, just say "Hey Sharky, Battery."
• On a web page, open the Custom Label dialog box for labeling an element by saying "Hey Sharky, Custom Label."
list end

 

Braille Math Editor

 

JAWS and Fusion currently supports reading Math equations on web pages that are displayed using MathML, or math equations in Microsoft Word documents inserted
using the native Word math format. You can navigate the individual elements of an equation using the Math Viewer, accessed by pressing ENTER from a web
page or INSERT+SPACEBAR followed by EQUALS from a Word document when focused on the equation. If JAWS braille translation is set to Unified English Braille
or United States English Grade 1 or Grade 2 output, math expressions are also shown on a braille display using Nemeth Braille format.

 

The new Braille Math Editor in JAWS now enables braille users in Windows 10 to input their own equations, and in Office 365, edit existing equations in
Word documents. To open the Math Editor, press the layered command INSERT+SPACEBAR followed by SHIFT+EQUALS (plus sign). Focus braille display users can
also press DOTS 3-4-6-7 CHORD.

 

When the Math Editor opens, focus is placed into an edit field where you can immediately begin typing the equation in Nemeth braille from your braille
display's keyboard. As you type, a preview pane below the edit field visually displays the equation so a sighted teacher or parent can review it. Once
you are finished inputting the math equation, press ENTER or choose the Accept button to close the Math Editor. If you are in Word, the equation you entered
is automatically inserted into the document at your current location. The equation is also copied to the Clipboard so you can paste it in other applications.

 

Opening the Math Editor while focused on a math equation in a Word document displays the existing equation in Nemeth Braille, allowing you to edit or replace
it. After making any changes and pressing ENTER to close the editor, the current equation in the document is replaced by the new or modified equation.

 

Note: After inserting or modifying an equation in Word from the Math Editor, the blinking cursor (dots 7 and 8) on the braille display always remains at
the beginning of the math content, even as you move by character with the LEFT and RIGHT ARROW keys. If you need to insert another line of math content,
first press the END key to move to the end of the current math content and then press ENTER.

 

While the Math Editor is opened, you have the following additional options:

 

list of 3 items
• Press CTRL+N to start a new equation.
• Press CTRL+P to preview the current equation in the Math Viewer. When finished, press ESC to return to the Math Editor.
• Press ALT+E to open the edit menu where you can copy your Nemeth Braille to the Clipboard using a specific format. MathML is the default format when
copying, however, depending on the application where you intend to paste the equation, you can also choose to copy your Nemeth Braille to LaTeX or Braille
ASCII. After choosing a format to copy to, paste the equation into the specific application before pressing ENTER or selecting Accept to close the Math
Editor as this always copies as MathML and will erase the current clipboard contents.
list end

 

To learn more about Nemeth Braille, check out this
Nemeth Tutorial
 which teaches this braille code beginning with the very basics up through advanced mathematics.

 

Other Changes
list of 12 items
• Resolved an issue where JAWS was not announcing the download status of files in Edge Chromium.
• Addressed an issue where the text of a link in a GMail message was not being read if it spanned multiple lines.
• When selecting a link or button on a web page that opens a modal dialog such as a calendar, resolved an issue where JAWS was reading the entire contents
of the dialog all at once as soon as it gained focus.
• JAWS now indicates when you move in and out of text in Google Docs that is marked as a suggestion.
• Expanded the description in Commands Search for setting a temporary PlaceMarker (CTRL+WINDOWS+K) to describe how this keystroke is used as part of selecting
text.
• Added the Copy Speech History to Clipboard keystroke (INSERT+SPACEBAR, CTRL+H) to Commands Search.
• Updated the description in Commands Search for the Read Address Bar keystroke (INSERT+A) so it can be found by searching for either "URL" or "address."
• If the Navigation Quick Key Manager is launched from an Outlook message, the Navigation Quick Key N for moving through messages in a thread, is now listed
so you can reassign it if necessary. The Navigation Quick Key Manager is located in the Run JAWS Manager dialog box (INSERT+F2).
• Resolved an issue where Navigation Quick Keys in Outlook messages would sometimes unexpectedly stop working until you moved focus away then back to the
message.
• When selecting text in Outlook messages for copying and pasting, addressed an issue where selection was not always working as expected, causing the wrong
text to be selected. This occurred most often in messages containing lists.
• Updated the INSERT+H help for Excel to list all of the latest JAWS hot keys.
• Added a new dictionary rule for "FYI" so JAWS no longer says the more verbose "for your information" when encountering this acronym.
list end

 


moderated Re: IE being removed from Win 10 20H2 and later, effective June 15th 2022

 

For those who want to ensure access to IE into the foreseeable future, you would be far better off to acquire either an old Windows 7 machine or Windows 8.1 machine for this purpose, if possible.

Windows 7 is already out of support and well past its official end of life date, and IE will never be removed.  Given the nature of the announcement, and that Windows 8.1 is nearing end of life in January 2023, it's improbable that it will end up being removed under that version of Windows, either.  

It's still possible to find refurbished machines out there with Windows 7 on them and 8.1 is somewhat easier to find.  At the moment, though, prices have risen due to demand related to all the stay-at-home from the pandemic.

If you need IE, your best bet is to have a purpose-dedicated machine where it, and its operating system, are encased in amber.  Of course, one would use it only for accessing IE-dependent sites, and pretty much nothing else.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042  

It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not.

           ~ André Gide


moderated Re: IE being removed from Win 10 20H2 and later, effective June 15th 2022

Don Mauck
 

Well said!! Stay up with the times or get left in the dark!!

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Lori Lynn
Sent: Friday, May 21, 2021 8:53 AM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: [External] : Re: IE being removed from Win 10 20H2 and later, effective June 15th 2022

 

I usually keep quiet on these long threads, but I’ve got to toss my 2 cents in.

 

“cheap throwaway computer”? You may have the money to replace your computer whenever the wind blows, but that’s just totally nuts! If you are crazy enough to turn off all the system updates and not backup your computer then you deserve whatever happens to both you and your machine. Companies like Microsoft have lots of experts who are working hard to make the systems and their components the best they can for all of us.

 

They have made the decision to eliminate a very old application in I E. They aren’t the first company to make this kind of decision and they won’t be the last. You’ve got two choices. You can either deal with it and use another browser or you can give up computers and go back to the dark ages. Me, I accepted their decision a long time ago and have moved forward. I remember the days of DOS and even before that. I will never go backwards!

 

Lori Lynn

 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 


moderated Re: IE being removed from Win 10 20H2 and later, effective June 15th 2022

Lori Lynn
 

I usually keep quiet on these long threads, but I’ve got to toss my 2 cents in.

 

“cheap throwaway computer”? You may have the money to replace your computer whenever the wind blows, but that’s just totally nuts! If you are crazy enough to turn off all the system updates and not backup your computer then you deserve whatever happens to both you and your machine. Companies like Microsoft have lots of experts who are working hard to make the systems and their components the best they can for all of us.

 

They have made the decision to eliminate a very old application in I E. They aren’t the first company to make this kind of decision and they won’t be the last. You’ve got two choices. You can either deal with it and use another browser or you can give up computers and go back to the dark ages. Me, I accepted their decision a long time ago and have moved forward. I remember the days of DOS and even before that. I will never go backwards!

 

Lori Lynn

 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 


moderated Re: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

Richard Turner
 

I am running the May update to Jaws 2021 and the Windows Clipboard is working the way it always had for me.

Jaws is reading the entries after I hit Windows+v and I can arrow to the one I want to paste and hit enter, and it is pasted.

 

I don’t know if you do your updates this way, but I always download the package and install, rather than going through the update wizard because I think the wizard’s wand is damaged.

 

 

 

 

Richard

"The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, but what they become by it."

- John Ruskin, 1819-1900

 

Web site: www.turner42.com

 

 

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Cristóbal
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 7:38 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

 

Just tried it. Didn’t work.

Thanks anyway.

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris Hill
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 5:16 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

 

This is a feature i just turned on.  I had no luck getting jaws to read it (current version recently updated).  Then I reloaded jaws, problem solved.  I suspect that jaws loading on startup may be causing the problem, just unload and reload it.

 

 

On 5/20/2021 18:58, Cristóbal wrote:

Or… I could ask the list community if there’s perhaps an alternative clipboard utility that’s accessible with Jaws I could use in the meantime without having to jump through all those impractical hoops.

I’ve tried Ditto and ClipAngel so far. I already mentioned Ditto previously. ClipAngel seems like a nifty little tool, but while the menus are accessible, I can’t seem to find any of the copied text entries. So it’s basically a no go.

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Glenn / Lenny
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 4:52 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

 

Well you could unload your licensed copy, and load the demo when need be and unload that and go back to the licensed copy.

Of course the time limit keeps going so you'd have to reboot after 40 minutes.

But it's better than nothing.

 

----- Original Message -----

From: Cristóbal

Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 6:47 PM

Subject: Re: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

 

Not practical in the least.

While I do use NVDA for the odd task her and there, Jaws is my primary screen reader and how I run my business. Outlook, Excel, Word etc. Hence my asking about Jaws to begin with…

Running JFW in demo mode throughout the day would be terribly disruptive as well.

This is why I specifically asked about an alternative application while this hopefully gets fixed.

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Glenn / Lenny
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 4:44 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

 

Maybe download the Jaws 2020 and if you cannot license it, run it as a demo.

Or you could install NVDA.

 

Glenn

----- Original Message -----

From: Cristóbal

Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 6:40 PM

Subject: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

 

Hello list,

So it seems like the May 2021 Jaws update broke the Windows clipboard. Broke in the sense that while the clipboard itself still works, Jaws isn’t speaking the various copied entries when arrowing around which is causing me all sorts of fits.

This actually happened a couple of months ago and at that time, I simply rolled back to the prior version of Jaws. Vispero did put out a new update which fixed the problem and that’s what I attempted to do this time, but even after rolling back to the April 2021 Jaws where the clipboard worked before installing the May 2021 update, now it seems that not even the April Jaws update is working right with the clipboard.

So anyway, I don’t have time for Vispero to investigate the issue and hopefully do something to fix this bug. In the meantime, I need to access this particular feature for my work. Is there an alternative Windows 10 clipboard utility that I can use? I tried downloading Ditto, but as it’s an extension to the Windows 10 clipboard itself, no luck there.

Thanks,

Cristóbal

 


moderated Re: IE being removed from Win 10 20H2 and later, effective June 15th 2022

James English
 

That would be great if I used this computer for anything but browsing
the web and a bit of media playback. It's the one that I travel around
with, because it's light and cheap and contains no information that I
don't have either on another computer or stored on my file server or
in the cloud. If, when I travel away for the weekend next week I left
the computer on the train, I would have another one, with all the data
from this one, available when I get home. The computer doesn't hold
any bank information, credit card information or information that
would let a stranger find me. This being the case there is no point
talking about the security implications of stopping updates to
preserve IE, or of continuing to use it as I have covered all the
bases.

So if you know a way of disabling windows updates, I would be very
happy to know despite the damage that could be done to the computer I
don't care about or the data that's backed up.

- James

On 5/21/21, Brian Vogel <britechguy@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, May 21, 2021 at 10:19 AM, James English wrote:


Is there something you fear happening to this cheap throwaway computer
that is so terrible? I believe it's possible to stop updates in windows
10
by disabling the update service, is this no longer the case?
-
I have zero concerns about anything happening to the computer that could not
be reversed, at least as far as having a running computer goes.  Nor do most
who are issuing warnings.  What we worry about is loss of data, often years
worth of data, and often containing things like family photos, massive music
libraries where the source material is no longer available, etc., etc.,
etc.    If you do a full system image backup and separate user backups
routinely you come as close to completely eliminating your exposure on those
counts entirely.

I will not discuss any hacks that can be done to prevent any operating
system from receiving updates.  Of course these exist.  The people who
created these OSes in the first place and who are the ones maintaining them
are in the very best position to know what updates are necessary, and why.
No one has ever put it better than John Carrona, a BSOD (Blue Screen of
Death) expert, now retired due to health issues, and who was in a far better
position to speak definitively about this than I could ever hope to be:

There really isn't a point to checking for updates and not installing them.
. .  It's important to install *all* available updates. I've been doing this
since the days of DOS, and I still don't have the confidence to pick and
choose among updates.  There are just too many variables involved - and most
people can't evaluate the full consequences of installing/not installing
updates.

~ John Carrona, AKA *usasma (
https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/u/35824/usasma/ )* on
BleepingComputer.com, http://www.carrona.org/ ( http://www.carrona.org/ )

If someone with his depth of expertise feels that he could not reliably,
"evaluate the full consequences of intsalling/not installing updates," nor
feel confident that he could possibly know all the variables involved in the
need for them . . .
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042

*It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are
not.*

~ André Gide






moderated Re: IE being removed from Win 10 20H2 and later, effective June 15th 2022

 

On Fri, May 21, 2021 at 10:19 AM, James English wrote:
Is there something you fear happening to this cheap throwaway computer that is so terrible? I believe it's possible to stop updates in windows 10 by disabling the update service, is this no longer the case?
-
I have zero concerns about anything happening to the computer that could not be reversed, at least as far as having a running computer goes.  Nor do most who are issuing warnings.  What we worry about is loss of data, often years worth of data, and often containing things like family photos, massive music libraries where the source material is no longer available, etc., etc., etc.    If you do a full system image backup and separate user backups routinely you come as close to completely eliminating your exposure on those counts entirely.

I will not discuss any hacks that can be done to prevent any operating system from receiving updates.  Of course these exist.  The people who created these OSes in the first place and who are the ones maintaining them are in the very best position to know what updates are necessary, and why.  No one has ever put it better than John Carrona, a BSOD (Blue Screen of Death) expert, now retired due to health issues, and who was in a far better position to speak definitively about this than I could ever hope to be:

There really isn't a point to checking for updates and not installing them. . .  It's important to install all available updates. I've been doing this since the days of DOS, and I still don't have the confidence to pick and choose among updates.  There are just too many variables involved - and most people can't evaluate the full consequences of installing/not installing updates.

        ~ John Carrona, AKA usasma on BleepingComputer.com, http://www.carrona.org/


If someone with his depth of expertise feels that he could not reliably, "evaluate the full consequences of intsalling/not installing updates," nor feel confident that he could possibly know all the variables involved in the need for them . . .
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042  

It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not.

           ~ André Gide


moderated Re: IE being removed from Win 10 20H2 and later, effective June 15th 2022

James English
 

Is there something you fear happening to this cheap throwaway computer
that is so terrible? I believe it's possible to stop updates in
windows 10 by disabling the update service, is this no longer the
case?

On 5/21/21, Brian Vogel <britechguy@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, May 21, 2021 at 01:02 AM, Randy Barnett wrote:


A little personal responsibility and common sense will do more than
worrying about MS not supporting software.
-
Personal responsibility and common sense in the world of computing includes
*not* using unsupported software except where absolutely necessary.

Working in this field, I know far better than you that "most adults" don't
give this a second thought or, worse, do what happens here and go to the
barricades to defend the stupid. Using unsupported software when supported
alternatives are available, particularly for email clients, web browsers,
and other things in constant intimate contact with cyberspace is very stupid
indeed.  A word to the wise should be sufficient.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042

*It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are
not.*

~ André Gide






moderated Re: IE being removed from Win 10 20H2 and later, effective June 15th 2022

 

On Fri, May 21, 2021 at 01:02 AM, Randy Barnett wrote:
A little personal responsibility and common sense will do more than worrying about MS not supporting software.
-
Personal responsibility and common sense in the world of computing includes not using unsupported software except where absolutely necessary.

Working in this field, I know far better than you that "most adults" don't give this a second thought or, worse, do what happens here and go to the barricades to defend the stupid. Using unsupported software when supported alternatives are available, particularly for email clients, web browsers, and other things in constant intimate contact with cyberspace is very stupid indeed.  A word to the wise should be sufficient.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042  

It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not.

           ~ André Gide


moderated Re: IE being removed from Win 10 20H2 and later, effective June 15th 2022

Randy Barnett <blindmansbluff09@...>
 


I dont know anyone that has been hacked or had a virus in years.

On 5/20/2021 1:25 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:


moderated Re: IE being removed from Win 10 20H2 and later, effective June 15th 2022

Randy Barnett <blindmansbluff09@...>
 

A little personal responsibility and common sense will do more than worrying about MS not supporting software... The latest greatest software wont protect you if you don't think before activating something or going to a unknown site... And incessant preaching and belittling people about this is not helpful.. Most adults can think for themselves and don't need nannies.

On 5/20/2021 1:22 PM, Glenn / Lenny wrote:

I think the security concerns are mainly for people who unconsously click on things.
 
----- Original Message -----
From: G. Gray
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 3:17 PM
Subject: Re: IE being removed from Win 10 20H2 and later, effective June 15th 2022

Thought I'd weigh in on this one.  I used Windows XP from 2004 until 2018 when my XP machine failed.  Meanwhile Win. 7, 8, 8.1 and 10 passed me by.  Constantly I'd read that XP was dangerous to use on the web and even with e-mail!! 


Yet through it all I had absolutely no problems and I used the web every day for lengthy periods of time.  With the MS security updates...you rarely or NEVER know what these are for.   I got no virus's or hacks, etc.


These 7 words I live by..."If it ain't broke, don't fix it."


Listening for the Shout!,
1 Thessalonians 4:16-18


George
On 5/19/2021 10:13 PM, Brian Vogel wrote:
On Wed, May 19, 2021 at 11:08 PM, Glenn / Lenny wrote:
7 is safe and still valid.
-
This sentiment is not shared, particularly the first part, by anyone who's an IT professional.

I really don't care what you, or any given individual, choose to do in your own world.  That really is entirely your choice, as you have to live with it and its consequences.

It is never, ever "safe" to use an out-of-support version of Windows.   It's just the opposite of "safe."  You may never have any issue, and very often that's just the proverbial "dumb luck."
 
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042  

It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not.

           ~ André Gide




Avast logo

This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
www.avast.com



moderated Re: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

Cristóbal
 

Just tried it. Didn’t work.

Thanks anyway.

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris Hill
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 5:16 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

 

This is a feature i just turned on.  I had no luck getting jaws to read it (current version recently updated).  Then I reloaded jaws, problem solved.  I suspect that jaws loading on startup may be causing the problem, just unload and reload it.

 

 

On 5/20/2021 18:58, Cristóbal wrote:

Or… I could ask the list community if there’s perhaps an alternative clipboard utility that’s accessible with Jaws I could use in the meantime without having to jump through all those impractical hoops.

I’ve tried Ditto and ClipAngel so far. I already mentioned Ditto previously. ClipAngel seems like a nifty little tool, but while the menus are accessible, I can’t seem to find any of the copied text entries. So it’s basically a no go.

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Glenn / Lenny
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 4:52 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

 

Well you could unload your licensed copy, and load the demo when need be and unload that and go back to the licensed copy.

Of course the time limit keeps going so you'd have to reboot after 40 minutes.

But it's better than nothing.

 

----- Original Message -----

From: Cristóbal

Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 6:47 PM

Subject: Re: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

 

Not practical in the least.

While I do use NVDA for the odd task her and there, Jaws is my primary screen reader and how I run my business. Outlook, Excel, Word etc. Hence my asking about Jaws to begin with…

Running JFW in demo mode throughout the day would be terribly disruptive as well.

This is why I specifically asked about an alternative application while this hopefully gets fixed.

 

From: main@jfw.groups.io <main@jfw.groups.io> On Behalf Of Glenn / Lenny
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 4:44 PM
To: main@jfw.groups.io
Subject: Re: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

 

Maybe download the Jaws 2020 and if you cannot license it, run it as a demo.

Or you could install NVDA.

 

Glenn

----- Original Message -----

From: Cristóbal

Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2021 6:40 PM

Subject: Jaws accessible Windows 10 clipboard alternative?

 

Hello list,

So it seems like the May 2021 Jaws update broke the Windows clipboard. Broke in the sense that while the clipboard itself still works, Jaws isn’t speaking the various copied entries when arrowing around which is causing me all sorts of fits.

This actually happened a couple of months ago and at that time, I simply rolled back to the prior version of Jaws. Vispero did put out a new update which fixed the problem and that’s what I attempted to do this time, but even after rolling back to the April 2021 Jaws where the clipboard worked before installing the May 2021 update, now it seems that not even the April Jaws update is working right with the clipboard.

So anyway, I don’t have time for Vispero to investigate the issue and hopefully do something to fix this bug. In the meantime, I need to access this particular feature for my work. Is there an alternative Windows 10 clipboard utility that I can use? I tried downloading Ditto, but as it’s an extension to the Windows 10 clipboard itself, no luck there.

Thanks,

Cristóbal

 


moderated Re: IE being removed from Win 10 20H2 and later, effective June 15th 2022

 

On Thu, May 20, 2021 at 08:44 PM, Glenn / Lenny wrote:
I'm surprised MS will allow you to turn off updates in windows 10.
-
They don't.  You can delay them, particularly in Pro.  And it would be sheer insanity to block updates to Windows 10, or any operating system.
--

Brian - Windows 10 Pro, 64-Bit, Version 20H2, Build 19042  

It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not.

           ~ André Gide

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