Date   

Re: serial number

Lisle, Ted (CHFS DMS)
 

Yes, we talked about that last week. I think I still have a copy of JFD
over in my filing cabinet in that nice binder, along with the first JFW
1.X--talk about a packrat, I don't even have an installed floppy drive
to my name.


Ted

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of James
Homuth
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 1:30 PM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.'
Subject: RE: serial number

Probably 2.0 or somewhere around that. Most especially if you required
external speech for it. Elequence wasn't a part of JFW until at least
3.0.
At least, that's when I remember seeing it anyway.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Cy
Selfridge
Sent: October 8, 2012 1:26 PM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.'
Subject: RE: serial number

Hmm, I can't remember exactly which version of JAWS I started with but I
do recall that we had to install Windows 3.1 in order to run it.
As I said before, my SN is 49XX.
Cy

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Farfar
Carlson
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 11:21 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: serial number

Wonder if the "Grimsby" has one lower than that?

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 14, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "James Homuth" <james@the-jdh.com>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 10:17
Subject: RE: serial number


Sounds like I've got most of you beat if we're going by serial numbers.
I
started running both JAWS for DOS and JAWS for Windows, back in the JFW
2.0
and Windows 3.1 days. My serial number's 59xx (yes, it's only 4 digits).

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Abby
Vincent
Sent: October 8, 2012 11:58 AM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.'
Subject: RE: serial number

I started with JAWS for DOS. My number starts with 83 and has remained
the
same, even with the transition to JAWS for Windows. It doesn't look
like
the theory that the lower your serial number, the earlier you started
using
JAWS is true. I also remember when you had to have an external speech
synthesizer to use JAWS, or any other screen reader. Now, thank
goodness,
you can use your sound card.
Enjoy Indigenous Peoples' Day,
Abby

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of
john.falter
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 8:19 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: serial number

I don't think you can go that way. I got JAWS in '96 and my number is
about
7400.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cy Selfridge" <cyselfridge@comcast.net>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 8:45 AM
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition


Hi,
I believe I started with JAWS in 1993 and my sn is 49XX.
I think I started with version 3.something.
Cy

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Soronel
Haetir
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 5:12 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition

No, I started using jaws during the transition period between jfw8 and
9.
I
have had several SMAs in the meantime as well as purchasing the remote
access option, but my SN has not changed.

On 10/2/12, Farfar Carlson <dgcarlson@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Good idea. Mine is 35xxx and I purchased back in version 3.5. However
it may

be that a new purchase serial number maintains the first digits as
the version in force at the time. My 35xxx aligns with version 3.5.
Was your first version 4.2?

IF this is the scheme, then FS allowed for up to 1000 new users per
version,

and might change the serial prefix with each new version. We'd have
to collect a fair number of serial numbers to be sure of this.

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 13.0.718, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "Soronel Haetir" <soronel.haetir@gmail.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 15:02
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


Well, we could make a guess by serial numbers.

My jaws serial number is about 427400 and I purchased jaws in late
2007 if memory serves.

I am pretty sure FS does in fact use incremental SN, not some odd
pattern with lots of holes. If we had someone who is a very recent
purchaser we could get an idea about both the overall population as
well as how fast it is growing.

On 10/2/12, Farfar Carlson <dgcarlson@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Nope, and no idea.

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 13.0.718, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Logue" <bobcat11@telusplanet.net>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 14:45
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


I wonder if FS would release the number of licences or users they
have sold. Do we know how many Jaws users there are?

On 10/2/2012 10:24 AM, Gerald Levy wrote:

There is absolutely no way that two thirds of all blind people use
JAWS.
There are an estimated 1.2 million people in the US classified as
legally blind, but only a small fraction, perhaps less than 10% use
computers with screen readers. The overwhelming majority of blind
people do not use computers, so the actual number of JAWS users is
probably quite small. Also, an estimated 70% of blind people are
unemployed, so they would have little or no means of acquiring
computers or commercial screen readers. And the vast majority of
JAWS users do not belong to this or other blind-tech related
mailing lists, so they would have no way of learning about the
petition. FS keeps the number of JAWS customers a closely guarded
secret, so nobody really knows how many blind people are actually
using it. But if I had to venture a guess, I would say that the
number of JAWS users might be somewhere between 50,000 and 150,000,
but this is only a wild guess not based on any facts or evidence.

Gerald


----- Original Message ----- From: "Marquette, Ed"
<Ed.Marquette@KutakRock.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 11:45 AM
Subject: Freedom Scientific Petition


All:
As promised, I am about to put the Freedom Scientific "Gimmick
Feature Moratorium" petition up on the Internet. Before doing so,
I have a couple of questions:

1. The Change.org petition form suggests (perhaps requires) a
sign-up goal. I'd be interested in suggestions as to the number
of JAWS users that should sign such a petition to be considered a
success. One of those helping with the drafting of the petition
has information that two thirds of all blind persons use JAWS.
Does anyone have any idea how many people that is? What would be
a reasonable percentage of signers to expect? Looking for
suggestions here. I'm happy to accept responses off-line. Although
this is JAWS-related, I don't want to spark a flurry of off-topic
discussions
again.
2. Change.org is, to my way of thinking, a little awkward when it
comes to screen reader usage. It isn't bad, but there are some
less than intuitive prompts. I would like this petition to be on
the most accessible public petition Website possible. Would
anyone on the list perhaps know of a site for a public petition
that is better and/or more accessible than is Change.org?
Thanks to the off-line support and drafting assistance. We've
tried to accommodate the views expressed on this list and
elsewhere even though, in some instances, the interests were not
always
congruent.
In the petition, we have not cited specific issues. I actually
started to do that, but I wanted to get the petition up before
Christmas. <SMILE> Thanks for all your help!


I. Edward Marquette
Direct Dial: 816.502.4646
Mobile: 816.812.0088
Google Voice: 408.692.5640
Facsimile: 816.960.0041
Kutak Rock LLP
1010 Grand Boulevard
Suite 500
Kansas City, MO 64106
ed.marquette@kutakrock.com




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USED OR REFERRED TO IN THE PROMOTING, MARKETING OR RECOMMENDING OF
ANY ENTITY, INVESTMENT PLAN OR ARRANGEMENT, AND SUCH ADVICE IS NOT
INTENDED OR WRITTEN TO BE USED, AND CANNOT BE USED, BY A TAXPAYER
FOR THE PURPOSE OF AVOIDING PENALTIES UNDER THE INTERNAL REVENUE
CODE.

This E-mail message is confidential, is intended only for the
named recipients above and may contain information that is
privileged, attorney work product or otherwise protected by
applicable law. If you have received this message in error, please
notify the sender at 402-346-6000 and delete this E-mail message.
Thank you.
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soronel.haetir@gmail.com

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Re: serial number

northstar1950@...
 

hmmm, she said that her number started with 83 and my first serial number i had started with 56 and ended with 71 but i never updated that number to the current release. that would cost too much money to do so.


Legend has it that on Monday 10/8/2012 11:20 AM, Farfar Carlson said:
----------------------------------------
Abby,

With a number like 83, why aren't you on the Board of Directors for FS?

Impressed.

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 14, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "Abby Vincent" <aevincent@ca.rr.com>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 08:58
Subject: RE: serial number


I started with JAWS for DOS. My number starts with 83 and has remained the
same, even with the transition to JAWS for Windows. It doesn't look like
the theory that the lower your serial number, the earlier you started using
JAWS is true. I also remember when you had to have an external speech
synthesizer to use JAWS, or any other screen reader. Now, thank goodness,
you can use your sound card.
Enjoy Indigenous Peoples' Day,
Abby

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of john.falter
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 8:19 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: serial number

I don't think you can go that way. I got JAWS in '96 and my number is about
7400.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cy Selfridge" <cyselfridge@comcast.net>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 8:45 AM
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition


Hi,
I believe I started with JAWS in 1993 and my sn is 49XX.
I think I started with version 3.something.
Cy

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Soronel
Haetir
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 5:12 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition

No, I started using jaws during the transition period between jfw8 and
9.
I
have had several SMAs in the meantime as well as purchasing the remote
access option, but my SN has not changed.

On 10/2/12, Farfar Carlson <dgcarlson@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Good idea. Mine is 35xxx and I purchased back in version 3.5. However
it may

be that a new purchase serial number maintains the first digits as
the version in force at the time. My 35xxx aligns with version 3.5.
Was your first version 4.2?

IF this is the scheme, then FS allowed for up to 1000 new users per
version,

and might change the serial prefix with each new version. We'd have
to collect a fair number of serial numbers to be sure of this.

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 13.0.718, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "Soronel Haetir" <soronel.haetir@gmail.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 15:02
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


Well, we could make a guess by serial numbers.

My jaws serial number is about 427400 and I purchased jaws in late
2007 if memory serves.

I am pretty sure FS does in fact use incremental SN, not some odd
pattern with lots of holes. If we had someone who is a very recent
purchaser we could get an idea about both the overall population as
well as how fast it is growing.

On 10/2/12, Farfar Carlson <dgcarlson@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Nope, and no idea.

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 13.0.718, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Logue" <bobcat11@telusplanet.net>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 14:45
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


I wonder if FS would release the number of licences or users they
have sold. Do we know how many Jaws users there are?

On 10/2/2012 10:24 AM, Gerald Levy wrote:

There is absolutely no way that two thirds of all blind people use
JAWS.
There are an estimated 1.2 million people in the US classified as
legally blind, but only a small fraction, perhaps less than 10% use
computers with screen readers. The overwhelming majority of blind
people do not use computers, so the actual number of JAWS users is
probably quite small. Also, an estimated 70% of blind people are
unemployed, so they would have little or no means of acquiring
computers or commercial screen readers. And the vast majority of
JAWS users do not belong to this or other blind-tech related
mailing lists, so they would have no way of learning about the
petition. FS keeps the number of JAWS customers a closely guarded
secret, so nobody really knows how many blind people are actually
using it. But if I had to venture a guess, I would say that the
number of JAWS users might be somewhere between 50,000 and 150,000,
but this is only a wild guess not based on any facts or evidence.

Gerald


----- Original Message ----- From: "Marquette, Ed"
<Ed.Marquette@KutakRock.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 11:45 AM
Subject: Freedom Scientific Petition


All:
As promised, I am about to put the Freedom Scientific "Gimmick
Feature Moratorium" petition up on the Internet. Before doing so,
I have a couple of questions:

1. The Change.org petition form suggests (perhaps requires) a
sign-up goal. I'd be interested in suggestions as to the number
of JAWS users that should sign such a petition to be considered a
success. One of those helping with the drafting of the petition
has information that two thirds of all blind persons use JAWS.
Does anyone have any idea how many people that is? What would be
a reasonable percentage of signers to expect? Looking for
suggestions here. I'm happy to accept responses off-line. Although
this is JAWS-related, I don't want to spark a flurry of off-topic
discussions
again.
2. Change.org is, to my way of thinking, a little awkward when it
comes to screen reader usage. It isn't bad, but there are some
less than intuitive prompts. I would like this petition to be on
the most accessible public petition Website possible. Would
anyone on the list perhaps know of a site for a public petition
that is better and/or more accessible than is Change.org?
Thanks to the off-line support and drafting assistance. We've
tried to accommodate the views expressed on this list and
elsewhere even though, in some instances, the interests were not
always
congruent.
In the petition, we have not cited specific issues. I actually
started to do that, but I wanted to get the petition up before
Christmas. <SMILE> Thanks for all your help!


I. Edward Marquette
Direct Dial: 816.502.4646
Mobile: 816.812.0088
Google Voice: 408.692.5640
Facsimile: 816.960.0041
Kutak Rock LLP
1010 Grand Boulevard
Suite 500
Kansas City, MO 64106
ed.marquette@kutakrock.com




ANY FEDERAL TAX ADVICE CONTAINED IN THIS MESSAGE SHOULD NOT BE
USED OR REFERRED TO IN THE PROMOTING, MARKETING OR RECOMMENDING OF
ANY ENTITY, INVESTMENT PLAN OR ARRANGEMENT, AND SUCH ADVICE IS NOT
INTENDED OR WRITTEN TO BE USED, AND CANNOT BE USED, BY A TAXPAYER
FOR THE PURPOSE OF AVOIDING PENALTIES UNDER THE INTERNAL REVENUE
CODE.

This E-mail message is confidential, is intended only for the
named recipients above and may contain information that is
privileged, attorney work product or otherwise protected by
applicable law. If you have received this message in error, please
notify the sender at 402-346-6000 and delete this E-mail message.
Thank you.
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--
Soronel Haetir
soronel.haetir@gmail.com

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soronel.haetir@gmail.com

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Re: serial number

James Homuth
 

Probably 2.0 or somewhere around that. Most especially if you required
external speech for it. Elequence wasn't a part of JFW until at least 3.0.
At least, that's when I remember seeing it anyway.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Cy Selfridge
Sent: October 8, 2012 1:26 PM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.'
Subject: RE: serial number

Hmm, I can't remember exactly which version of JAWS I started with but I do
recall that we had to install Windows 3.1 in order to run it.
As I said before, my SN is 49XX.
Cy

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Farfar Carlson
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 11:21 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: serial number

Wonder if the "Grimsby" has one lower than that?

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 14, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "James Homuth" <james@the-jdh.com>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 10:17
Subject: RE: serial number


Sounds like I've got most of you beat if we're going by serial numbers. I
started running both JAWS for DOS and JAWS for Windows, back in the JFW 2.0
and Windows 3.1 days. My serial number's 59xx (yes, it's only 4 digits).

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Abby Vincent
Sent: October 8, 2012 11:58 AM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.'
Subject: RE: serial number

I started with JAWS for DOS. My number starts with 83 and has remained the
same, even with the transition to JAWS for Windows. It doesn't look like
the theory that the lower your serial number, the earlier you started using
JAWS is true. I also remember when you had to have an external speech
synthesizer to use JAWS, or any other screen reader. Now, thank goodness,
you can use your sound card.
Enjoy Indigenous Peoples' Day,
Abby

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of john.falter
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 8:19 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: serial number

I don't think you can go that way. I got JAWS in '96 and my number is about
7400.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cy Selfridge" <cyselfridge@comcast.net>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 8:45 AM
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition


Hi,
I believe I started with JAWS in 1993 and my sn is 49XX.
I think I started with version 3.something.
Cy

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Soronel
Haetir
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 5:12 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition

No, I started using jaws during the transition period between jfw8 and 9.
I
have had several SMAs in the meantime as well as purchasing the remote
access option, but my SN has not changed.

On 10/2/12, Farfar Carlson <dgcarlson@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Good idea. Mine is 35xxx and I purchased back in version 3.5. However
it may

be that a new purchase serial number maintains the first digits as
the version in force at the time. My 35xxx aligns with version 3.5.
Was your first version 4.2?

IF this is the scheme, then FS allowed for up to 1000 new users per
version,

and might change the serial prefix with each new version. We'd have
to collect a fair number of serial numbers to be sure of this.

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 13.0.718, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "Soronel Haetir" <soronel.haetir@gmail.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 15:02
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


Well, we could make a guess by serial numbers.

My jaws serial number is about 427400 and I purchased jaws in late
2007 if memory serves.

I am pretty sure FS does in fact use incremental SN, not some odd
pattern with lots of holes. If we had someone who is a very recent
purchaser we could get an idea about both the overall population as
well as how fast it is growing.

On 10/2/12, Farfar Carlson <dgcarlson@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Nope, and no idea.

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 13.0.718, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Logue" <bobcat11@telusplanet.net>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 14:45
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


I wonder if FS would release the number of licences or users they
have sold. Do we know how many Jaws users there are?

On 10/2/2012 10:24 AM, Gerald Levy wrote:

There is absolutely no way that two thirds of all blind people use
JAWS.
There are an estimated 1.2 million people in the US classified as
legally blind, but only a small fraction, perhaps less than 10% use
computers with screen readers. The overwhelming majority of blind
people do not use computers, so the actual number of JAWS users is
probably quite small. Also, an estimated 70% of blind people are
unemployed, so they would have little or no means of acquiring
computers or commercial screen readers. And the vast majority of
JAWS users do not belong to this or other blind-tech related
mailing lists, so they would have no way of learning about the
petition. FS keeps the number of JAWS customers a closely guarded
secret, so nobody really knows how many blind people are actually
using it. But if I had to venture a guess, I would say that the
number of JAWS users might be somewhere between 50,000 and 150,000,
but this is only a wild guess not based on any facts or evidence.

Gerald


----- Original Message ----- From: "Marquette, Ed"
<Ed.Marquette@KutakRock.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 11:45 AM
Subject: Freedom Scientific Petition


All:
As promised, I am about to put the Freedom Scientific "Gimmick
Feature Moratorium" petition up on the Internet. Before doing so,
I have a couple of questions:

1. The Change.org petition form suggests (perhaps requires) a
sign-up goal. I'd be interested in suggestions as to the number
of JAWS users that should sign such a petition to be considered a
success. One of those helping with the drafting of the petition
has information that two thirds of all blind persons use JAWS.
Does anyone have any idea how many people that is? What would be
a reasonable percentage of signers to expect? Looking for
suggestions here. I'm happy to accept responses off-line. Although
this is JAWS-related, I don't want to spark a flurry of off-topic
discussions
again.
2. Change.org is, to my way of thinking, a little awkward when it
comes to screen reader usage. It isn't bad, but there are some
less than intuitive prompts. I would like this petition to be on
the most accessible public petition Website possible. Would
anyone on the list perhaps know of a site for a public petition
that is better and/or more accessible than is Change.org?
Thanks to the off-line support and drafting assistance. We've
tried to accommodate the views expressed on this list and
elsewhere even though, in some instances, the interests were not
always
congruent.
In the petition, we have not cited specific issues. I actually
started to do that, but I wanted to get the petition up before
Christmas. <SMILE> Thanks for all your help!


I. Edward Marquette
Direct Dial: 816.502.4646
Mobile: 816.812.0088
Google Voice: 408.692.5640
Facsimile: 816.960.0041
Kutak Rock LLP
1010 Grand Boulevard
Suite 500
Kansas City, MO 64106
ed.marquette@kutakrock.com




ANY FEDERAL TAX ADVICE CONTAINED IN THIS MESSAGE SHOULD NOT BE
USED OR REFERRED TO IN THE PROMOTING, MARKETING OR RECOMMENDING OF
ANY ENTITY, INVESTMENT PLAN OR ARRANGEMENT, AND SUCH ADVICE IS NOT
INTENDED OR WRITTEN TO BE USED, AND CANNOT BE USED, BY A TAXPAYER
FOR THE PURPOSE OF AVOIDING PENALTIES UNDER THE INTERNAL REVENUE
CODE.

This E-mail message is confidential, is intended only for the
named recipients above and may contain information that is
privileged, attorney work product or otherwise protected by
applicable law. If you have received this message in error, please
notify the sender at 402-346-6000 and delete this E-mail message.
Thank you.
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Re: serial number

Cy Selfridge
 

Hmm, I can't remember exactly which version of JAWS I started with but I do
recall that we had to install Windows 3.1 in order to run it.
As I said before, my SN is 49XX.
Cy

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Farfar Carlson
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 11:21 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: serial number

Wonder if the "Grimsby" has one lower than that?

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 14, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "James Homuth" <james@the-jdh.com>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 10:17
Subject: RE: serial number


Sounds like I've got most of you beat if we're going by serial numbers. I
started running both JAWS for DOS and JAWS for Windows, back in the JFW 2.0
and Windows 3.1 days. My serial number's 59xx (yes, it's only 4 digits).

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Abby Vincent
Sent: October 8, 2012 11:58 AM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.'
Subject: RE: serial number

I started with JAWS for DOS. My number starts with 83 and has remained the
same, even with the transition to JAWS for Windows. It doesn't look like
the theory that the lower your serial number, the earlier you started using
JAWS is true. I also remember when you had to have an external speech
synthesizer to use JAWS, or any other screen reader. Now, thank goodness,
you can use your sound card.
Enjoy Indigenous Peoples' Day,
Abby

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of john.falter
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 8:19 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: serial number

I don't think you can go that way. I got JAWS in '96 and my number is about
7400.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cy Selfridge" <cyselfridge@comcast.net>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 8:45 AM
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition


Hi,
I believe I started with JAWS in 1993 and my sn is 49XX.
I think I started with version 3.something.
Cy

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Soronel
Haetir
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 5:12 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition

No, I started using jaws during the transition period between jfw8 and 9.
I
have had several SMAs in the meantime as well as purchasing the remote
access option, but my SN has not changed.

On 10/2/12, Farfar Carlson <dgcarlson@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Good idea. Mine is 35xxx and I purchased back in version 3.5. However
it may

be that a new purchase serial number maintains the first digits as
the version in force at the time. My 35xxx aligns with version 3.5.
Was your first version 4.2?

IF this is the scheme, then FS allowed for up to 1000 new users per
version,

and might change the serial prefix with each new version. We'd have
to collect a fair number of serial numbers to be sure of this.

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 13.0.718, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "Soronel Haetir" <soronel.haetir@gmail.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 15:02
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


Well, we could make a guess by serial numbers.

My jaws serial number is about 427400 and I purchased jaws in late
2007 if memory serves.

I am pretty sure FS does in fact use incremental SN, not some odd
pattern with lots of holes. If we had someone who is a very recent
purchaser we could get an idea about both the overall population as
well as how fast it is growing.

On 10/2/12, Farfar Carlson <dgcarlson@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Nope, and no idea.

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 13.0.718, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Logue" <bobcat11@telusplanet.net>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 14:45
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


I wonder if FS would release the number of licences or users they
have sold. Do we know how many Jaws users there are?

On 10/2/2012 10:24 AM, Gerald Levy wrote:

There is absolutely no way that two thirds of all blind people use
JAWS.
There are an estimated 1.2 million people in the US classified as
legally blind, but only a small fraction, perhaps less than 10% use
computers with screen readers. The overwhelming majority of blind
people do not use computers, so the actual number of JAWS users is
probably quite small. Also, an estimated 70% of blind people are
unemployed, so they would have little or no means of acquiring
computers or commercial screen readers. And the vast majority of
JAWS users do not belong to this or other blind-tech related
mailing lists, so they would have no way of learning about the
petition. FS keeps the number of JAWS customers a closely guarded
secret, so nobody really knows how many blind people are actually
using it. But if I had to venture a guess, I would say that the
number of JAWS users might be somewhere between 50,000 and 150,000,
but this is only a wild guess not based on any facts or evidence.

Gerald


----- Original Message ----- From: "Marquette, Ed"
<Ed.Marquette@KutakRock.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 11:45 AM
Subject: Freedom Scientific Petition


All:
As promised, I am about to put the Freedom Scientific "Gimmick
Feature Moratorium" petition up on the Internet. Before doing so,
I have a couple of questions:

1. The Change.org petition form suggests (perhaps requires) a
sign-up goal. I'd be interested in suggestions as to the number
of JAWS users that should sign such a petition to be considered a
success. One of those helping with the drafting of the petition
has information that two thirds of all blind persons use JAWS.
Does anyone have any idea how many people that is? What would be
a reasonable percentage of signers to expect? Looking for
suggestions here. I'm happy to accept responses off-line. Although
this is JAWS-related, I don't want to spark a flurry of off-topic
discussions
again.
2. Change.org is, to my way of thinking, a little awkward when it
comes to screen reader usage. It isn't bad, but there are some
less than intuitive prompts. I would like this petition to be on
the most accessible public petition Website possible. Would
anyone on the list perhaps know of a site for a public petition
that is better and/or more accessible than is Change.org?
Thanks to the off-line support and drafting assistance. We've
tried to accommodate the views expressed on this list and
elsewhere even though, in some instances, the interests were not
always
congruent.
In the petition, we have not cited specific issues. I actually
started to do that, but I wanted to get the petition up before
Christmas. <SMILE> Thanks for all your help!


I. Edward Marquette
Direct Dial: 816.502.4646
Mobile: 816.812.0088
Google Voice: 408.692.5640
Facsimile: 816.960.0041
Kutak Rock LLP
1010 Grand Boulevard
Suite 500
Kansas City, MO 64106
ed.marquette@kutakrock.com




ANY FEDERAL TAX ADVICE CONTAINED IN THIS MESSAGE SHOULD NOT BE
USED OR REFERRED TO IN THE PROMOTING, MARKETING OR RECOMMENDING OF
ANY ENTITY, INVESTMENT PLAN OR ARRANGEMENT, AND SUCH ADVICE IS NOT
INTENDED OR WRITTEN TO BE USED, AND CANNOT BE USED, BY A TAXPAYER
FOR THE PURPOSE OF AVOIDING PENALTIES UNDER THE INTERNAL REVENUE
CODE.

This E-mail message is confidential, is intended only for the
named recipients above and may contain information that is
privileged, attorney work product or otherwise protected by
applicable law. If you have received this message in error, please
notify the sender at 402-346-6000 and delete this E-mail message.
Thank you.
-------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was
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--
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soronel.haetir@gmail.com

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soronel.haetir@gmail.com

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Re: serial number

Dave...
 

Wonder if the "Grimsby" has one lower than that?

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 14, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit

----- Original Message -----
From: "James Homuth" <james@the-jdh.com>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 10:17
Subject: RE: serial number


Sounds like I've got most of you beat if we're going by serial numbers. I
started running both JAWS for DOS and JAWS for Windows, back in the JFW 2.0
and Windows 3.1 days. My serial number's 59xx (yes, it's only 4 digits).

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Abby Vincent
Sent: October 8, 2012 11:58 AM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.'
Subject: RE: serial number

I started with JAWS for DOS. My number starts with 83 and has remained the
same, even with the transition to JAWS for Windows. It doesn't look like
the theory that the lower your serial number, the earlier you started using
JAWS is true. I also remember when you had to have an external speech
synthesizer to use JAWS, or any other screen reader. Now, thank goodness,
you can use your sound card.
Enjoy Indigenous Peoples' Day,
Abby

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of john.falter
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 8:19 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: serial number

I don't think you can go that way. I got JAWS in '96 and my number is about
7400.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cy Selfridge" <cyselfridge@comcast.net>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 8:45 AM
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition


Hi,
I believe I started with JAWS in 1993 and my sn is 49XX.
I think I started with version 3.something.
Cy

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Soronel
Haetir
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 5:12 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition

No, I started using jaws during the transition period between jfw8 and 9.
I
have had several SMAs in the meantime as well as purchasing the remote
access option, but my SN has not changed.

On 10/2/12, Farfar Carlson <dgcarlson@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Good idea. Mine is 35xxx and I purchased back in version 3.5. However
it may

be that a new purchase serial number maintains the first digits as
the version in force at the time. My 35xxx aligns with version 3.5.
Was your first version 4.2?

IF this is the scheme, then FS allowed for up to 1000 new users per
version,

and might change the serial prefix with each new version. We'd have
to collect a fair number of serial numbers to be sure of this.

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 13.0.718, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "Soronel Haetir" <soronel.haetir@gmail.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 15:02
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


Well, we could make a guess by serial numbers.

My jaws serial number is about 427400 and I purchased jaws in late
2007 if memory serves.

I am pretty sure FS does in fact use incremental SN, not some odd
pattern with lots of holes. If we had someone who is a very recent
purchaser we could get an idea about both the overall population as
well as how fast it is growing.

On 10/2/12, Farfar Carlson <dgcarlson@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Nope, and no idea.

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 13.0.718, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Logue" <bobcat11@telusplanet.net>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 14:45
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


I wonder if FS would release the number of licences or users they
have sold. Do we know how many Jaws users there are?

On 10/2/2012 10:24 AM, Gerald Levy wrote:

There is absolutely no way that two thirds of all blind people use
JAWS.
There are an estimated 1.2 million people in the US classified as
legally blind, but only a small fraction, perhaps less than 10% use
computers with screen readers. The overwhelming majority of blind
people do not use computers, so the actual number of JAWS users is
probably quite small. Also, an estimated 70% of blind people are
unemployed, so they would have little or no means of acquiring
computers or commercial screen readers. And the vast majority of
JAWS users do not belong to this or other blind-tech related
mailing lists, so they would have no way of learning about the
petition. FS keeps the number of JAWS customers a closely guarded
secret, so nobody really knows how many blind people are actually
using it. But if I had to venture a guess, I would say that the
number of JAWS users might be somewhere between 50,000 and 150,000,
but this is only a wild guess not based on any facts or evidence.

Gerald


----- Original Message ----- From: "Marquette, Ed"
<Ed.Marquette@KutakRock.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 11:45 AM
Subject: Freedom Scientific Petition


All:
As promised, I am about to put the Freedom Scientific "Gimmick
Feature Moratorium" petition up on the Internet. Before doing so,
I have a couple of questions:

1. The Change.org petition form suggests (perhaps requires) a
sign-up goal. I'd be interested in suggestions as to the number
of JAWS users that should sign such a petition to be considered a
success. One of those helping with the drafting of the petition
has information that two thirds of all blind persons use JAWS.
Does anyone have any idea how many people that is? What would be
a reasonable percentage of signers to expect? Looking for
suggestions here. I'm happy to accept responses off-line. Although
this is JAWS-related, I don't want to spark a flurry of off-topic
discussions
again.
2. Change.org is, to my way of thinking, a little awkward when it
comes to screen reader usage. It isn't bad, but there are some
less than intuitive prompts. I would like this petition to be on
the most accessible public petition Website possible. Would
anyone on the list perhaps know of a site for a public petition
that is better and/or more accessible than is Change.org?
Thanks to the off-line support and drafting assistance. We've
tried to accommodate the views expressed on this list and
elsewhere even though, in some instances, the interests were not
always
congruent.
In the petition, we have not cited specific issues. I actually
started to do that, but I wanted to get the petition up before
Christmas. <SMILE> Thanks for all your help!


I. Edward Marquette
Direct Dial: 816.502.4646
Mobile: 816.812.0088
Google Voice: 408.692.5640
Facsimile: 816.960.0041
Kutak Rock LLP
1010 Grand Boulevard
Suite 500
Kansas City, MO 64106
ed.marquette@kutakrock.com




ANY FEDERAL TAX ADVICE CONTAINED IN THIS MESSAGE SHOULD NOT BE
USED OR REFERRED TO IN THE PROMOTING, MARKETING OR RECOMMENDING OF
ANY ENTITY, INVESTMENT PLAN OR ARRANGEMENT, AND SUCH ADVICE IS NOT
INTENDED OR WRITTEN TO BE USED, AND CANNOT BE USED, BY A TAXPAYER
FOR THE PURPOSE OF AVOIDING PENALTIES UNDER THE INTERNAL REVENUE
CODE.

This E-mail message is confidential, is intended only for the
named recipients above and may contain information that is
privileged, attorney work product or otherwise protected by
applicable law. If you have received this message in error, please
notify the sender at 402-346-6000 and delete this E-mail message.
Thank you.
-------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was
scrubbed...
URL:
<http://lists.the-jdh.com/pipermail/jfw_lists.the-jdh.com/attachme
n ts/20121002/0e0ebc12/attachment.html>

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--
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soronel.haetir@gmail.com

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--
Soronel Haetir
soronel.haetir@gmail.com

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Re: serial number

James Homuth
 

Sounds like I've got most of you beat if we're going by serial numbers. I
started running both JAWS for DOS and JAWS for Windows, back in the JFW 2.0
and Windows 3.1 days. My serial number's 59xx (yes, it's only 4 digits).

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Abby Vincent
Sent: October 8, 2012 11:58 AM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.'
Subject: RE: serial number

I started with JAWS for DOS. My number starts with 83 and has remained the
same, even with the transition to JAWS for Windows. It doesn't look like
the theory that the lower your serial number, the earlier you started using
JAWS is true. I also remember when you had to have an external speech
synthesizer to use JAWS, or any other screen reader. Now, thank goodness,
you can use your sound card.
Enjoy Indigenous Peoples' Day,
Abby

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of john.falter
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 8:19 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: serial number

I don't think you can go that way. I got JAWS in '96 and my number is about
7400.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cy Selfridge" <cyselfridge@comcast.net>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 8:45 AM
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition


Hi,
I believe I started with JAWS in 1993 and my sn is 49XX.
I think I started with version 3.something.
Cy

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Soronel
Haetir
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 5:12 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition

No, I started using jaws during the transition period between jfw8 and 9.
I
have had several SMAs in the meantime as well as purchasing the remote
access option, but my SN has not changed.

On 10/2/12, Farfar Carlson <dgcarlson@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Good idea. Mine is 35xxx and I purchased back in version 3.5. However
it may

be that a new purchase serial number maintains the first digits as
the version in force at the time. My 35xxx aligns with version 3.5.
Was your first version 4.2?

IF this is the scheme, then FS allowed for up to 1000 new users per
version,

and might change the serial prefix with each new version. We'd have
to collect a fair number of serial numbers to be sure of this.

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 13.0.718, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "Soronel Haetir" <soronel.haetir@gmail.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 15:02
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


Well, we could make a guess by serial numbers.

My jaws serial number is about 427400 and I purchased jaws in late
2007 if memory serves.

I am pretty sure FS does in fact use incremental SN, not some odd
pattern with lots of holes. If we had someone who is a very recent
purchaser we could get an idea about both the overall population as
well as how fast it is growing.

On 10/2/12, Farfar Carlson <dgcarlson@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Nope, and no idea.

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 13.0.718, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Logue" <bobcat11@telusplanet.net>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 14:45
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


I wonder if FS would release the number of licences or users they
have sold. Do we know how many Jaws users there are?

On 10/2/2012 10:24 AM, Gerald Levy wrote:

There is absolutely no way that two thirds of all blind people use
JAWS.
There are an estimated 1.2 million people in the US classified as
legally blind, but only a small fraction, perhaps less than 10% use
computers with screen readers. The overwhelming majority of blind
people do not use computers, so the actual number of JAWS users is
probably quite small. Also, an estimated 70% of blind people are
unemployed, so they would have little or no means of acquiring
computers or commercial screen readers. And the vast majority of
JAWS users do not belong to this or other blind-tech related
mailing lists, so they would have no way of learning about the
petition. FS keeps the number of JAWS customers a closely guarded
secret, so nobody really knows how many blind people are actually
using it. But if I had to venture a guess, I would say that the
number of JAWS users might be somewhere between 50,000 and 150,000,
but this is only a wild guess not based on any facts or evidence.

Gerald


----- Original Message ----- From: "Marquette, Ed"
<Ed.Marquette@KutakRock.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 11:45 AM
Subject: Freedom Scientific Petition


All:
As promised, I am about to put the Freedom Scientific "Gimmick
Feature Moratorium" petition up on the Internet. Before doing so,
I have a couple of questions:

1. The Change.org petition form suggests (perhaps requires) a
sign-up goal. I'd be interested in suggestions as to the number
of JAWS users that should sign such a petition to be considered a
success. One of those helping with the drafting of the petition
has information that two thirds of all blind persons use JAWS.
Does anyone have any idea how many people that is? What would be
a reasonable percentage of signers to expect? Looking for
suggestions here. I'm happy to accept responses off-line. Although
this is JAWS-related, I don't want to spark a flurry of off-topic
discussions
again.
2. Change.org is, to my way of thinking, a little awkward when it
comes to screen reader usage. It isn't bad, but there are some
less than intuitive prompts. I would like this petition to be on
the most accessible public petition Website possible. Would
anyone on the list perhaps know of a site for a public petition
that is better and/or more accessible than is Change.org?
Thanks to the off-line support and drafting assistance. We've
tried to accommodate the views expressed on this list and
elsewhere even though, in some instances, the interests were not
always
congruent.
In the petition, we have not cited specific issues. I actually
started to do that, but I wanted to get the petition up before
Christmas. <SMILE> Thanks for all your help!


I. Edward Marquette
Direct Dial: 816.502.4646
Mobile: 816.812.0088
Google Voice: 408.692.5640
Facsimile: 816.960.0041
Kutak Rock LLP
1010 Grand Boulevard
Suite 500
Kansas City, MO 64106
ed.marquette@kutakrock.com




ANY FEDERAL TAX ADVICE CONTAINED IN THIS MESSAGE SHOULD NOT BE
USED OR REFERRED TO IN THE PROMOTING, MARKETING OR RECOMMENDING OF
ANY ENTITY, INVESTMENT PLAN OR ARRANGEMENT, AND SUCH ADVICE IS NOT
INTENDED OR WRITTEN TO BE USED, AND CANNOT BE USED, BY A TAXPAYER
FOR THE PURPOSE OF AVOIDING PENALTIES UNDER THE INTERNAL REVENUE
CODE.

This E-mail message is confidential, is intended only for the
named recipients above and may contain information that is
privileged, attorney work product or otherwise protected by
applicable law. If you have received this message in error, please
notify the sender at 402-346-6000 and delete this E-mail message.
Thank you.
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soronel.haetir@gmail.com

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Re: Flexible Web in JAWS 14 is a Hit!

Dave...
 

Brian,

Yes, that's why I'm actually promoting a revision of JAWS. It is a quantum
step toward improving access to web sites -- especially those that we use
often.

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 14, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit

----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian and Denise Albriton" <autoharp@shellworld.net>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 09:41
Subject: Re: Flexible Web in JAWS 14 is a Hit!


This is a hit with me as well. I visit one of those sites with lots of
links to comment that are truly clutter and the site is nice and clean now
thanks to flexible web.
You'rs is even more better. You do actual work on yours.
Brian


On Fri, 5 Oct 2012, Farfar Carlson wrote:

Just after sending out my petition to FS to stop adding features and focus
on fixing bugs, they roll out this feature in the Beta 2 cycle.

Skeptical as I am, I listened to the Podcast and then intrigued, I gave it
a spin with a site I use in my J-O-B every day: Sales Force dot com

What a time saver! Now I can get rid of so much clutter that I needed to
tab or search through on every visit to the site to enter sales data. Cuts
down my tabbing by more than 50% and speeds up searching by headers and
tables. My left pinky finger will last longer and perhaps not develop
arthritis quite as soon now.

All kidding aside, this is a truly beneficial tool to use for anyone who
uses certain web sites repeatedly, and similar web sites occasionally. I'd
say it's the best breakthrough since they made MS Excel accessible -- it's
that astounding.

So if you haven't tried it and you have the Beta 2 cycle loaded, don't
waste any more time without trying it out.

Damry and company, you've made my next SMA worth the money.


Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 14.0.730, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit

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Re: Flexible Web in JAWS 14 is a Hit!

Brian and Denise Albriton <autoharp@...>
 

This is a hit with me as well. I visit one of those sites with lots of links to comment that are truly clutter and the site is nice and clean now thanks to flexible web.
You'rs is even more better. You do actual work on yours.
Brian

On Fri, 5 Oct 2012, Farfar Carlson wrote:

Just after sending out my petition to FS to stop adding features and focus on fixing bugs, they roll out this feature in the Beta 2 cycle.

Skeptical as I am, I listened to the Podcast and then intrigued, I gave it a spin with a site I use in my J-O-B every day: Sales Force dot com

What a time saver! Now I can get rid of so much clutter that I needed to tab or search through on every visit to the site to enter sales data. Cuts down my tabbing by more than 50% and speeds up searching by headers and tables. My left pinky finger will last longer and perhaps not develop arthritis quite as soon now.

All kidding aside, this is a truly beneficial tool to use for anyone who uses certain web sites repeatedly, and similar web sites occasionally. I'd say it's the best breakthrough since they made MS Excel accessible -- it's that astounding.

So if you haven't tried it and you have the Beta 2 cycle loaded, don't waste any more time without trying it out.

Damry and company, you've made my next SMA worth the money.


Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell Latitude E6520, JAWS 14.0.730, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit

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Re: serial number

Dave...
 

Abby,

With a number like 83, why aren't you on the Board of Directors for FS?

Impressed.

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 14, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit

----- Original Message -----
From: "Abby Vincent" <aevincent@ca.rr.com>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 08:58
Subject: RE: serial number


I started with JAWS for DOS. My number starts with 83 and has remained the
same, even with the transition to JAWS for Windows. It doesn't look like
the theory that the lower your serial number, the earlier you started using
JAWS is true. I also remember when you had to have an external speech
synthesizer to use JAWS, or any other screen reader. Now, thank goodness,
you can use your sound card.
Enjoy Indigenous Peoples' Day,
Abby

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of john.falter
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 8:19 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: serial number

I don't think you can go that way. I got JAWS in '96 and my number is about
7400.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cy Selfridge" <cyselfridge@comcast.net>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 8:45 AM
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition


Hi,
I believe I started with JAWS in 1993 and my sn is 49XX.
I think I started with version 3.something.
Cy

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Soronel
Haetir
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 5:12 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition

No, I started using jaws during the transition period between jfw8 and 9.
I
have had several SMAs in the meantime as well as purchasing the remote
access option, but my SN has not changed.

On 10/2/12, Farfar Carlson <dgcarlson@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Good idea. Mine is 35xxx and I purchased back in version 3.5. However
it may

be that a new purchase serial number maintains the first digits as
the version in force at the time. My 35xxx aligns with version 3.5.
Was your first version 4.2?

IF this is the scheme, then FS allowed for up to 1000 new users per
version,

and might change the serial prefix with each new version. We'd have
to collect a fair number of serial numbers to be sure of this.

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 13.0.718, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "Soronel Haetir" <soronel.haetir@gmail.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 15:02
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


Well, we could make a guess by serial numbers.

My jaws serial number is about 427400 and I purchased jaws in late
2007 if memory serves.

I am pretty sure FS does in fact use incremental SN, not some odd
pattern with lots of holes. If we had someone who is a very recent
purchaser we could get an idea about both the overall population as
well as how fast it is growing.

On 10/2/12, Farfar Carlson <dgcarlson@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Nope, and no idea.

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 13.0.718, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Logue" <bobcat11@telusplanet.net>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 14:45
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


I wonder if FS would release the number of licences or users they
have sold. Do we know how many Jaws users there are?

On 10/2/2012 10:24 AM, Gerald Levy wrote:

There is absolutely no way that two thirds of all blind people use
JAWS.
There are an estimated 1.2 million people in the US classified as
legally blind, but only a small fraction, perhaps less than 10% use
computers with screen readers. The overwhelming majority of blind
people do not use computers, so the actual number of JAWS users is
probably quite small. Also, an estimated 70% of blind people are
unemployed, so they would have little or no means of acquiring
computers or commercial screen readers. And the vast majority of
JAWS users do not belong to this or other blind-tech related
mailing lists, so they would have no way of learning about the
petition. FS keeps the number of JAWS customers a closely guarded
secret, so nobody really knows how many blind people are actually
using it. But if I had to venture a guess, I would say that the
number of JAWS users might be somewhere between 50,000 and 150,000,
but this is only a wild guess not based on any facts or evidence.

Gerald


----- Original Message ----- From: "Marquette, Ed"
<Ed.Marquette@KutakRock.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 11:45 AM
Subject: Freedom Scientific Petition


All:
As promised, I am about to put the Freedom Scientific "Gimmick
Feature Moratorium" petition up on the Internet. Before doing so,
I have a couple of questions:

1. The Change.org petition form suggests (perhaps requires) a
sign-up goal. I'd be interested in suggestions as to the number
of JAWS users that should sign such a petition to be considered a
success. One of those helping with the drafting of the petition
has information that two thirds of all blind persons use JAWS.
Does anyone have any idea how many people that is? What would be
a reasonable percentage of signers to expect? Looking for
suggestions here. I'm happy to accept responses off-line. Although
this is JAWS-related, I don't want to spark a flurry of off-topic
discussions
again.
2. Change.org is, to my way of thinking, a little awkward when it
comes to screen reader usage. It isn't bad, but there are some
less than intuitive prompts. I would like this petition to be on
the most accessible public petition Website possible. Would
anyone on the list perhaps know of a site for a public petition
that is better and/or more accessible than is Change.org?
Thanks to the off-line support and drafting assistance. We've
tried to accommodate the views expressed on this list and
elsewhere even though, in some instances, the interests were not
always
congruent.
In the petition, we have not cited specific issues. I actually
started to do that, but I wanted to get the petition up before
Christmas. <SMILE> Thanks for all your help!


I. Edward Marquette
Direct Dial: 816.502.4646
Mobile: 816.812.0088
Google Voice: 408.692.5640
Facsimile: 816.960.0041
Kutak Rock LLP
1010 Grand Boulevard
Suite 500
Kansas City, MO 64106
ed.marquette@kutakrock.com




ANY FEDERAL TAX ADVICE CONTAINED IN THIS MESSAGE SHOULD NOT BE
USED OR REFERRED TO IN THE PROMOTING, MARKETING OR RECOMMENDING OF
ANY ENTITY, INVESTMENT PLAN OR ARRANGEMENT, AND SUCH ADVICE IS NOT
INTENDED OR WRITTEN TO BE USED, AND CANNOT BE USED, BY A TAXPAYER
FOR THE PURPOSE OF AVOIDING PENALTIES UNDER THE INTERNAL REVENUE
CODE.

This E-mail message is confidential, is intended only for the
named recipients above and may contain information that is
privileged, attorney work product or otherwise protected by
applicable law. If you have received this message in error, please
notify the sender at 402-346-6000 and delete this E-mail message.
Thank you.
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--
Soronel Haetir
soronel.haetir@gmail.com

_______________________________________________
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_______________________________________________
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--
Soronel Haetir
soronel.haetir@gmail.com

_______________________________________________
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Re: serial number

Abby Vincent <aevincent@...>
 

I started with JAWS for DOS. My number starts with 83 and has remained the
same, even with the transition to JAWS for Windows. It doesn't look like
the theory that the lower your serial number, the earlier you started using
JAWS is true. I also remember when you had to have an external speech
synthesizer to use JAWS, or any other screen reader. Now, thank goodness,
you can use your sound card.
Enjoy Indigenous Peoples' Day,
Abby

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of john.falter
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 8:19 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: serial number

I don't think you can go that way. I got JAWS in '96 and my number is about
7400.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cy Selfridge" <cyselfridge@comcast.net>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 8:45 AM
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition


Hi,
I believe I started with JAWS in 1993 and my sn is 49XX.
I think I started with version 3.something.
Cy

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Soronel
Haetir
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 5:12 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition

No, I started using jaws during the transition period between jfw8 and 9.
I
have had several SMAs in the meantime as well as purchasing the remote
access option, but my SN has not changed.

On 10/2/12, Farfar Carlson <dgcarlson@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Good idea. Mine is 35xxx and I purchased back in version 3.5. However
it may

be that a new purchase serial number maintains the first digits as
the version in force at the time. My 35xxx aligns with version 3.5.
Was your first version 4.2?

IF this is the scheme, then FS allowed for up to 1000 new users per
version,

and might change the serial prefix with each new version. We'd have
to collect a fair number of serial numbers to be sure of this.

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 13.0.718, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "Soronel Haetir" <soronel.haetir@gmail.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 15:02
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


Well, we could make a guess by serial numbers.

My jaws serial number is about 427400 and I purchased jaws in late
2007 if memory serves.

I am pretty sure FS does in fact use incremental SN, not some odd
pattern with lots of holes. If we had someone who is a very recent
purchaser we could get an idea about both the overall population as
well as how fast it is growing.

On 10/2/12, Farfar Carlson <dgcarlson@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Nope, and no idea.

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 13.0.718, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Logue" <bobcat11@telusplanet.net>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 14:45
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


I wonder if FS would release the number of licences or users they
have sold. Do we know how many Jaws users there are?

On 10/2/2012 10:24 AM, Gerald Levy wrote:

There is absolutely no way that two thirds of all blind people use
JAWS.
There are an estimated 1.2 million people in the US classified as
legally blind, but only a small fraction, perhaps less than 10% use
computers with screen readers. The overwhelming majority of blind
people do not use computers, so the actual number of JAWS users is
probably quite small. Also, an estimated 70% of blind people are
unemployed, so they would have little or no means of acquiring
computers or commercial screen readers. And the vast majority of
JAWS users do not belong to this or other blind-tech related
mailing lists, so they would have no way of learning about the
petition. FS keeps the number of JAWS customers a closely guarded
secret, so nobody really knows how many blind people are actually
using it. But if I had to venture a guess, I would say that the
number of JAWS users might be somewhere between 50,000 and 150,000,
but this is only a wild guess not based on any facts or evidence.

Gerald


----- Original Message ----- From: "Marquette, Ed"
<Ed.Marquette@KutakRock.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 11:45 AM
Subject: Freedom Scientific Petition


All:
As promised, I am about to put the Freedom Scientific "Gimmick
Feature Moratorium" petition up on the Internet. Before doing so,
I have a couple of questions:

1. The Change.org petition form suggests (perhaps requires) a
sign-up goal. I'd be interested in suggestions as to the number
of JAWS users that should sign such a petition to be considered a
success. One of those helping with the drafting of the petition
has information that two thirds of all blind persons use JAWS.
Does anyone have any idea how many people that is? What would be
a reasonable percentage of signers to expect? Looking for
suggestions here. I'm happy to accept responses off-line. Although
this is JAWS-related, I don't want to spark a flurry of off-topic
discussions
again.
2. Change.org is, to my way of thinking, a little awkward when it
comes to screen reader usage. It isn't bad, but there are some
less than intuitive prompts. I would like this petition to be on
the most accessible public petition Website possible. Would
anyone on the list perhaps know of a site for a public petition
that is better and/or more accessible than is Change.org?
Thanks to the off-line support and drafting assistance. We've
tried to accommodate the views expressed on this list and
elsewhere even though, in some instances, the interests were not
always
congruent.
In the petition, we have not cited specific issues. I actually
started to do that, but I wanted to get the petition up before
Christmas. <SMILE> Thanks for all your help!


I. Edward Marquette
Direct Dial: 816.502.4646
Mobile: 816.812.0088
Google Voice: 408.692.5640
Facsimile: 816.960.0041
Kutak Rock LLP
1010 Grand Boulevard
Suite 500
Kansas City, MO 64106
ed.marquette@kutakrock.com




ANY FEDERAL TAX ADVICE CONTAINED IN THIS MESSAGE SHOULD NOT BE
USED OR REFERRED TO IN THE PROMOTING, MARKETING OR RECOMMENDING OF
ANY ENTITY, INVESTMENT PLAN OR ARRANGEMENT, AND SUCH ADVICE IS NOT
INTENDED OR WRITTEN TO BE USED, AND CANNOT BE USED, BY A TAXPAYER
FOR THE PURPOSE OF AVOIDING PENALTIES UNDER THE INTERNAL REVENUE
CODE.

This E-mail message is confidential, is intended only for the
named recipients above and may contain information that is
privileged, attorney work product or otherwise protected by
applicable law. If you have received this message in error, please
notify the sender at 402-346-6000 and delete this E-mail message.
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Re: Freedom Scientific Petition

Dave...
 

Adrian,

Waning? More like disintegrating, on my part. And that's not mentioning
anything physical.

Good points.

Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 14, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit

----- Original Message -----
From: "Adrian Spratt" <Adrian@AdrianSpratt.com>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 07:22
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition


The self-proclaimed seniors in this thread have used computers and
screenreaders since they were, as Ted put it, mere striplings. The elderly
population that is less likely to take on JAWS over, say, sixty consists of
people who haven't used computers at all or who haven't used adaptive aids
while working with computers. Several exceptions from this list alone come
to mind.

The relevance to JAWS is that the deficiencies that start or recur in new
versions are a cause of great frustration even for those of us who have
years of experience with the application. That level of frustration has to
be extremely discouraging to people of any age learning it for the first
time, and especially those who fear their intellectual powers are waning.
All the more reason for Ed's petition.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Cy Selfridge
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 9:52 AM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.'
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition

Hi Ted,
I believe I was just about 40 when I got my Apple II+.
Cy

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Lisle, Ted
(CHFS DMS)
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 6:28 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition

A few of us are seniors now, but were not when we started. I was a mere
stripling of 32 when I saw my first Apple.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 5:15 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


At 62 years of age, I am also a senior and have yet to encounter another
blind senior who uses a computer with JAWS or any other screen reader.
And most older sighted seniors I know want nothing to do with computers,
which they find difficult and confounding to learn and set up.

Gerald


----- Original Message -----
From: "Cy Selfridge" <cyselfridge@comcast.net>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 4:57 PM
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition


Hmm, I am a Senior and I know a whole lot of Seniors who use the
computer
as
it gives us a great way to "get out" and communicate with others.
Now, with the advent of the iPhone and Android a lot of folks who used
to
use the computer now use the phone.
I suppose there are still a lot of blind (as well as other handicapped
people) who are satisfied tojust sit on their asses and veg out.
Cy, The Humble Guy


-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Chris
Smart
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 2:52 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition



how many of those people are seniors? don't forget that probably three
quarters of the visually-impaired population are elderly.

At 04:50 PM 10/7/2012, you wrote:
Very odd statistics... what are they based on? You say less than 10%
of blind people use computers with a screen reader? I'd say that 95%
of the people I know who are blind, and, I know a lot of people who
are
blind, use a computer with a screen reader, and, most of these use
Jaws. I'm not criticizing you, just wonder how you arrive at your
stats.

Russell
Sent from my iMac running Mountain Lion!

On 2012-10-02, at 10:24 AM, Gerald Levy <bwaylimited@verizon.net>
wrote:


There is absolutely no way that two thirds of all blind people
use JAWS. There are an estimated 1.2 million people in the US
classified as legally blind, but only a small fraction, perhaps less
than 10% use computers with screen readers. The overwhelming
majority
of blind people do not use computers, so the actual number of JAWS
users is probably quite small. Also, an estimated 70% of blind people
are unemployed, so they would have little or no means of acquiring
computers or commercial screen readers. And the vast majority of
JAWS
users do not belong to this or other blind-tech related mailing
lists,
so they would have no way of learning about the petition. FS keeps
the number of JAWS customers a closely guarded secret, so nobody
really knows how many blind people are actually using it. But if I
had
to venture a guess, I would say that the number of JAWS users might
be
somewhere between 50,000 and 150,000, but this is only a wild guess
not based on any facts or evidence.

Gerald


----- Original Message ----- From: "Marquette, Ed"
<Ed.Marquette@KutakRock.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 11:45 AM
Subject: Freedom Scientific Petition


All:
As promised, I am about to put the Freedom Scientific "Gimmick
Feature Moratorium" petition up on the Internet. Before doing so, I
have a couple of questions:

1. The Change.org petition form suggests (perhaps requires) a
sign-up goal. I'd be interested in suggestions as to the number of
JAWS users that should sign such a petition to be considered a
success. One of those helping with the drafting of the petition has
information that two thirds of all blind persons use JAWS. Does
anyone have any idea how many people that is? What would be a
reasonable percentage of signers to expect? Looking for suggestions
here. I'm happy to accept responses off-line.
Although this is JAWS-related, I don't want to spark a flurry of
off-topic discussions again.
2. Change.org is, to my way of thinking, a little awkward
when it comes to screen reader usage. It isn't bad, but there are
some less than intuitive prompts. I would like this petition to be
on
the most accessible public petition Website possible. Would anyone
on
the list perhaps know of a site for a public petition that is better
and/or more accessible than is Change.org?
Thanks to the off-line support and drafting assistance. We've
tried to accommodate the views expressed on this list and elsewhere
even though, in some instances, the interests were not always
congruent.
In the petition, we have not cited specific issues. I
actually started to do that, but I wanted to get the petition up
before Christmas. <SMILE>
Thanks for all your help!


I. Edward Marquette
Direct Dial: 816.502.4646
Mobile: 816.812.0088
Google Voice: 408.692.5640
Facsimile: 816.960.0041
Kutak Rock LLP
1010 Grand Boulevard
Suite 500
Kansas City, MO 64106
ed.marquette@kutakrock.com




ANY FEDERAL TAX ADVICE CONTAINED IN THIS MESSAGE SHOULD NOT BE
USED OR REFERRED TO IN THE PROMOTING, MARKETING OR
RECOMMENDING OF ANY ENTITY, INVESTMENT PLAN OR ARRANGEMENT,
AND SUCH ADVICE IS NOT INTENDED OR WRITTEN TO BE USED,
AND CANNOT BE USED, BY A TAXPAYER FOR THE PURPOSE OF AVOIDING
PENALTIES UNDER THE INTERNAL REVENUE CODE.

This E-mail message is confidential, is intended only for the
named recipients above and may contain information
that is privileged, attorney work product or otherwise
protected by applicable law. If you have received this
message in error, please notify the sender at 402-346-6000 and
delete this E-mail message.
Thank you.
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Re: number testing and word testing of vocalizer voices TomandSamantha

Lisle, Ted (CHFS DMS)
 

Haven't noticed that problem with Eloquence, which is usually my
preferred synth.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of ptusing
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 11:13 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: number testing and word testing of vocalizer voices
TomandSamantha


Thanks, Ted,
My point is that weird pronounciations should be reported to the beta
team.

I have a friend who is testing words with vocalizer voices.

I note that
certain letter combinations like
"a g r" at the beginning of a word is totally messed up by Eloquence.
Is that true for voice Sam and Samantha?
Thanksfor testing the voices.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lisle, Ted (CHFS DMS)" <Ted.Lisle@ky.gov>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 10:44 AM
Subject: RE: number testing and word testing of vocalizer voices
TomandSamantha


JAWS allows one to customize dictionaries according to synthesizer.
I've noticed that RealSpeak handles some things far better than
Eloquence. But stumbles over simple things. Why on earth would
RealSpeak give a simple word like lame a French pronunciation in all
cases, but that's what it does. It confuses someone with a bad leg
with
one of Elvis's stage costumes.

I also notice certain idiosyncrasies in the Commonwealth (UK,
Australian) voices, which I suppose the programmer thinks are
typical--placing R's where they don't belong in certain situations
(some
of you will remember JFK's adding an R to Cuba in certain situations).

Ted

Ted

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of ptusing
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 9:42 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: number testing and word testing of vocalizer voices
TomandSamantha

Hi,
I appreciate your comments. I had heard that F S was supposedly
interested in poorly pronounced words or badly pronounced words in
combination. I will give 2 examples.

Both the voices Tom and Samantha mis sp eak some words ending in hard
consonants followed by words beginning with vowels like these 2 word
combinations:
mess around
grandarena
So I was simply attempting to do what was suggested--nothing more.
One person pointed out words beginning with"
aggr".
We will be stuck with this vocalizer synthesizer for sometime.
Have a fine day.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Farfar Carlson" <dgcarlson@sbcglobal.net>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 11:35 PM
Subject: Re: number testing and word testing of vocalizer voices Tom
andSamantha


Your research is laudable, but expecting that the problem lies with
JAWS may not be valid. How do you know that inconsistencies are not
the fault of Nuance?

If you really need to have accurate speech feedback, then your
research seem to indicate that you should stick with Eloquence.


Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 14, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "ptusing" <ptusing@sbcglobal.net>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 18:43
Subject: number testing and word testing of vocalizer voices Tom and
Samantha


Here is a number string andI report how Eloquence reads it.
Numbers are in quotations.
"
2.00 8 1.30 9 .30 7 50 6" but are listed below minusthequotations.

These numbers read literally like
two point oh oh eight one point three oh nine point three oh etc.
until
the last 3 numbers which are 7 then 50 and then 6.
The last numbers are read as seven fifty six.
2.00 8 1.30 9 .30 7 50 6





Now, a friend is testing the vocalizer Tom and Samantha with
3-syllable
words in sentences with lots of punctuationlike commas and dashes.



He is doing this to try to find problems which can be fixed during
the

beta.
|

Four syllable words seem good.



Final point,the individual helps peoplewith JAWS which I myself have
found
very useful



I think the Tom voice is slightly muffled but it and Samantha are
the
easiest to listen to for long time periods.



Will keep you posted per the voice experiment.



Have a fine day.


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Retesting vocalizer voicesand : Freedom Scientific Petition

ptusing <ptusing@...>
 

Hi,
If the experience with older people whoadopted JAWS in Japan is true elsewhere--like there are so many due to the long lifespans of elders there--then JAWS should work well for older peoplewho newly adoptJAWS.
That is why I am hoping that people will test the vocalizer voices as many older people have frequency variations in hearing but are
not that hearing impaired if they wear hearing aids
Andfinally, some day we will all be in that situation or at least an elder JAWS user.
.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Lisle, Ted (CHFS DMS)" <Ted.Lisle@ky.gov>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 11:14 AM
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition


That was my point exactly; we can't assume.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Adrian
Spratt
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 10:22 AM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.'
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition

The self-proclaimed seniors in this thread have used computers and
screenreaders since they were, as Ted put it, mere striplings. The
elderly population that is less likely to take on JAWS over, say, sixty
consists of people who haven't used computers at all or who haven't used
adaptive aids while working with computers. Several exceptions from this
list alone come to mind.

The relevance to JAWS is that the deficiencies that start or recur in
new versions are a cause of great frustration even for those of us who
have years of experience with the application. That level of frustration
has to be extremely discouraging to people of any age learning it for
the first time, and especially those who fear their intellectual powers
are waning.
All the more reason for Ed's petition.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Cy
Selfridge
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 9:52 AM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.'
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition

Hi Ted,
I believe I was just about 40 when I got my Apple II+.
Cy

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Lisle, Ted
(CHFS DMS)
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 6:28 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition

A few of us are seniors now, but were not when we started. I was a mere
stripling of 32 when I saw my first Apple.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Gerald
Levy
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 5:15 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


At 62 years of age, I am also a senior and have yet to encounter another
blind senior who uses a computer with JAWS or any other screen reader.
And most older sighted seniors I know want nothing to do with computers,
which they find difficult and confounding to learn and set up.

Gerald


----- Original Message -----
From: "Cy Selfridge" <cyselfridge@comcast.net>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 4:57 PM
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition


Hmm, I am a Senior and I know a whole lot of Seniors who use the
computer
as
it gives us a great way to "get out" and communicate with others.
Now, with the advent of the iPhone and Android a lot of folks who used
to
use the computer now use the phone.
I suppose there are still a lot of blind (as well as other handicapped
people) who are satisfied tojust sit on their asses and veg out.
Cy, The Humble Guy


-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Chris
Smart
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 2:52 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition



how many of those people are seniors? don't forget that probably three
quarters of the visually-impaired population are elderly.

At 04:50 PM 10/7/2012, you wrote:
Very odd statistics... what are they based on? You say less than 10%
of blind people use computers with a screen reader? I'd say that 95%
of the people I know who are blind, and, I know a lot of people who
are
blind, use a computer with a screen reader, and, most of these use
Jaws. I'm not criticizing you, just wonder how you arrive at your
stats.

Russell
Sent from my iMac running Mountain Lion!

On 2012-10-02, at 10:24 AM, Gerald Levy <bwaylimited@verizon.net>
wrote:


There is absolutely no way that two thirds of all blind people
use JAWS. There are an estimated 1.2 million people in the US
classified as legally blind, but only a small fraction, perhaps less
than 10% use computers with screen readers. The overwhelming
majority
of blind people do not use computers, so the actual number of JAWS
users is probably quite small. Also, an estimated 70% of blind people
are unemployed, so they would have little or no means of acquiring
computers or commercial screen readers. And the vast majority of
JAWS
users do not belong to this or other blind-tech related mailing
lists,
so they would have no way of learning about the petition. FS keeps
the number of JAWS customers a closely guarded secret, so nobody
really knows how many blind people are actually using it. But if I
had
to venture a guess, I would say that the number of JAWS users might
be
somewhere between 50,000 and 150,000, but this is only a wild guess
not based on any facts or evidence.

Gerald


----- Original Message ----- From: "Marquette, Ed"
<Ed.Marquette@KutakRock.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 11:45 AM
Subject: Freedom Scientific Petition


All:
As promised, I am about to put the Freedom Scientific "Gimmick
Feature Moratorium" petition up on the Internet. Before doing so, I
have a couple of questions:

1. The Change.org petition form suggests (perhaps requires) a
sign-up goal. I'd be interested in suggestions as to the number of
JAWS users that should sign such a petition to be considered a
success. One of those helping with the drafting of the petition has
information that two thirds of all blind persons use JAWS. Does
anyone have any idea how many people that is? What would be a
reasonable percentage of signers to expect? Looking for suggestions
here. I'm happy to accept responses off-line.
Although this is JAWS-related, I don't want to spark a flurry of
off-topic discussions again.
2. Change.org is, to my way of thinking, a little awkward
when it comes to screen reader usage. It isn't bad, but there are
some less than intuitive prompts. I would like this petition to be
on
the most accessible public petition Website possible. Would anyone
on
the list perhaps know of a site for a public petition that is better
and/or more accessible than is Change.org?
Thanks to the off-line support and drafting assistance. We've
tried to accommodate the views expressed on this list and elsewhere
even though, in some instances, the interests were not always
congruent.
In the petition, we have not cited specific issues. I
actually started to do that, but I wanted to get the petition up
before Christmas. <SMILE>
Thanks for all your help!


I. Edward Marquette
Direct Dial: 816.502.4646
Mobile: 816.812.0088
Google Voice: 408.692.5640
Facsimile: 816.960.0041
Kutak Rock LLP
1010 Grand Boulevard
Suite 500
Kansas City, MO 64106
ed.marquette@kutakrock.com




ANY FEDERAL TAX ADVICE CONTAINED IN THIS MESSAGE SHOULD NOT BE
USED OR REFERRED TO IN THE PROMOTING, MARKETING OR
RECOMMENDING OF ANY ENTITY, INVESTMENT PLAN OR ARRANGEMENT,
AND SUCH ADVICE IS NOT INTENDED OR WRITTEN TO BE USED,
AND CANNOT BE USED, BY A TAXPAYER FOR THE PURPOSE OF AVOIDING
PENALTIES UNDER THE INTERNAL REVENUE CODE.

This E-mail message is confidential, is intended only for the
named recipients above and may contain information
that is privileged, attorney work product or otherwise
protected by applicable law. If you have received this
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delete this E-mail message.
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Re: Freedom Scientific Petition

Lisle, Ted (CHFS DMS)
 

That was my point exactly; we can't assume.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Adrian
Spratt
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 10:22 AM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.'
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition

The self-proclaimed seniors in this thread have used computers and
screenreaders since they were, as Ted put it, mere striplings. The
elderly population that is less likely to take on JAWS over, say, sixty
consists of people who haven't used computers at all or who haven't used
adaptive aids while working with computers. Several exceptions from this
list alone come to mind.

The relevance to JAWS is that the deficiencies that start or recur in
new versions are a cause of great frustration even for those of us who
have years of experience with the application. That level of frustration
has to be extremely discouraging to people of any age learning it for
the first time, and especially those who fear their intellectual powers
are waning.
All the more reason for Ed's petition.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Cy
Selfridge
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 9:52 AM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.'
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition

Hi Ted,
I believe I was just about 40 when I got my Apple II+.
Cy

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Lisle, Ted
(CHFS DMS)
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 6:28 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition

A few of us are seniors now, but were not when we started. I was a mere
stripling of 32 when I saw my first Apple.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Gerald
Levy
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 5:15 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


At 62 years of age, I am also a senior and have yet to encounter another
blind senior who uses a computer with JAWS or any other screen reader.
And most older sighted seniors I know want nothing to do with computers,
which they find difficult and confounding to learn and set up.

Gerald


----- Original Message -----
From: "Cy Selfridge" <cyselfridge@comcast.net>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 4:57 PM
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition


Hmm, I am a Senior and I know a whole lot of Seniors who use the
computer
as
it gives us a great way to "get out" and communicate with others.
Now, with the advent of the iPhone and Android a lot of folks who used
to
use the computer now use the phone.
I suppose there are still a lot of blind (as well as other handicapped
people) who are satisfied tojust sit on their asses and veg out.
Cy, The Humble Guy


-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Chris
Smart
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 2:52 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition



how many of those people are seniors? don't forget that probably three
quarters of the visually-impaired population are elderly.

At 04:50 PM 10/7/2012, you wrote:
Very odd statistics... what are they based on? You say less than 10%
of blind people use computers with a screen reader? I'd say that 95%
of the people I know who are blind, and, I know a lot of people who
are
blind, use a computer with a screen reader, and, most of these use
Jaws. I'm not criticizing you, just wonder how you arrive at your
stats.

Russell
Sent from my iMac running Mountain Lion!

On 2012-10-02, at 10:24 AM, Gerald Levy <bwaylimited@verizon.net>
wrote:


There is absolutely no way that two thirds of all blind people
use JAWS. There are an estimated 1.2 million people in the US
classified as legally blind, but only a small fraction, perhaps less
than 10% use computers with screen readers. The overwhelming
majority
of blind people do not use computers, so the actual number of JAWS
users is probably quite small. Also, an estimated 70% of blind people
are unemployed, so they would have little or no means of acquiring
computers or commercial screen readers. And the vast majority of
JAWS
users do not belong to this or other blind-tech related mailing
lists,
so they would have no way of learning about the petition. FS keeps
the number of JAWS customers a closely guarded secret, so nobody
really knows how many blind people are actually using it. But if I
had
to venture a guess, I would say that the number of JAWS users might
be
somewhere between 50,000 and 150,000, but this is only a wild guess
not based on any facts or evidence.

Gerald


----- Original Message ----- From: "Marquette, Ed"
<Ed.Marquette@KutakRock.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 11:45 AM
Subject: Freedom Scientific Petition


All:
As promised, I am about to put the Freedom Scientific "Gimmick
Feature Moratorium" petition up on the Internet. Before doing so, I
have a couple of questions:

1. The Change.org petition form suggests (perhaps requires) a
sign-up goal. I'd be interested in suggestions as to the number of
JAWS users that should sign such a petition to be considered a
success. One of those helping with the drafting of the petition has
information that two thirds of all blind persons use JAWS. Does
anyone have any idea how many people that is? What would be a
reasonable percentage of signers to expect? Looking for suggestions
here. I'm happy to accept responses off-line.
Although this is JAWS-related, I don't want to spark a flurry of
off-topic discussions again.
2. Change.org is, to my way of thinking, a little awkward
when it comes to screen reader usage. It isn't bad, but there are
some less than intuitive prompts. I would like this petition to be
on
the most accessible public petition Website possible. Would anyone
on
the list perhaps know of a site for a public petition that is better
and/or more accessible than is Change.org?
Thanks to the off-line support and drafting assistance. We've
tried to accommodate the views expressed on this list and elsewhere
even though, in some instances, the interests were not always
congruent.
In the petition, we have not cited specific issues. I
actually started to do that, but I wanted to get the petition up
before Christmas. <SMILE>
Thanks for all your help!


I. Edward Marquette
Direct Dial: 816.502.4646
Mobile: 816.812.0088
Google Voice: 408.692.5640
Facsimile: 816.960.0041
Kutak Rock LLP
1010 Grand Boulevard
Suite 500
Kansas City, MO 64106
ed.marquette@kutakrock.com




ANY FEDERAL TAX ADVICE CONTAINED IN THIS MESSAGE SHOULD NOT BE
USED OR REFERRED TO IN THE PROMOTING, MARKETING OR
RECOMMENDING OF ANY ENTITY, INVESTMENT PLAN OR ARRANGEMENT,
AND SUCH ADVICE IS NOT INTENDED OR WRITTEN TO BE USED,
AND CANNOT BE USED, BY A TAXPAYER FOR THE PURPOSE OF AVOIDING
PENALTIES UNDER THE INTERNAL REVENUE CODE.

This E-mail message is confidential, is intended only for the
named recipients above and may contain information
that is privileged, attorney work product or otherwise
protected by applicable law. If you have received this
message in error, please notify the sender at 402-346-6000 and
delete this E-mail message.
Thank you.
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Re: number testing and word testing of vocalizer voices TomandSamantha

ptusing <ptusing@...>
 

Thanks, Ted,
My point is that weird pronounciations should be reported to the beta
team.

I have a friend who is testing words with vocalizer voices.

I note that
certain letter combinations like
"a g r" at the beginning of a word is totally messed up by Eloquence.
Is that true for voice Sam and Samantha?
Thanksfor testing the voices.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Lisle, Ted (CHFS DMS)" <Ted.Lisle@ky.gov>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 10:44 AM
Subject: RE: number testing and word testing of vocalizer voices TomandSamantha


JAWS allows one to customize dictionaries according to synthesizer.
I've noticed that RealSpeak handles some things far better than
Eloquence. But stumbles over simple things. Why on earth would
RealSpeak give a simple word like lame a French pronunciation in all
cases, but that's what it does. It confuses someone with a bad leg with
one of Elvis's stage costumes.

I also notice certain idiosyncrasies in the Commonwealth (UK,
Australian) voices, which I suppose the programmer thinks are
typical--placing R's where they don't belong in certain situations (some
of you will remember JFK's adding an R to Cuba in certain situations).

Ted

Ted

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of ptusing
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 9:42 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: number testing and word testing of vocalizer voices
TomandSamantha

Hi,
I appreciate your comments. I had heard that F S was supposedly
interested in poorly pronounced words or badly pronounced words in
combination. I will give 2 examples.

Both the voices Tom and Samantha mis sp eak some words ending in hard
consonants followed by words beginning with vowels like these 2 word
combinations:
mess around
grandarena
So I was simply attempting to do what was suggested--nothing more.
One person pointed out words beginning with"
aggr".
We will be stuck with this vocalizer synthesizer for sometime.
Have a fine day.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Farfar Carlson" <dgcarlson@sbcglobal.net>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 11:35 PM
Subject: Re: number testing and word testing of vocalizer voices Tom
andSamantha


Your research is laudable, but expecting that the problem lies with
JAWS may not be valid. How do you know that inconsistencies are not
the fault of Nuance?

If you really need to have accurate speech feedback, then your
research seem to indicate that you should stick with Eloquence.


Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 14, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "ptusing" <ptusing@sbcglobal.net>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 18:43
Subject: number testing and word testing of vocalizer voices Tom and
Samantha


Here is a number string andI report how Eloquence reads it.
Numbers are in quotations.
"
2.00 8 1.30 9 .30 7 50 6" but are listed below minusthequotations.

These numbers read literally like
two point oh oh eight one point three oh nine point three oh etc.
until
the last 3 numbers which are 7 then 50 and then 6.
The last numbers are read as seven fifty six.
2.00 8 1.30 9 .30 7 50 6





Now, a friend is testing the vocalizer Tom and Samantha with
3-syllable
words in sentences with lots of punctuationlike commas and dashes.



He is doing this to try to find problems which can be fixed during the
beta.
|

Four syllable words seem good.



Final point,the individual helps peoplewith JAWS which I myself have
found
very useful



I think the Tom voice is slightly muffled but it and Samantha are
the
easiest to listen to for long time periods.



Will keep you posted per the voice experiment.



Have a fine day.


_______________________________________________
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Jfw@lists.the-jdh.com
http://lists.the-jdh.com/mailman/listinfo/jfw_lists.the-jdh.com


_______________________________________________
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Re: number testing and word testing of vocalizer voices TomandSamantha

Lisle, Ted (CHFS DMS)
 

JAWS allows one to customize dictionaries according to synthesizer.
I've noticed that RealSpeak handles some things far better than
Eloquence. But stumbles over simple things. Why on earth would
RealSpeak give a simple word like lame a French pronunciation in all
cases, but that's what it does. It confuses someone with a bad leg with
one of Elvis's stage costumes.

I also notice certain idiosyncrasies in the Commonwealth (UK,
Australian) voices, which I suppose the programmer thinks are
typical--placing R's where they don't belong in certain situations (some
of you will remember JFK's adding an R to Cuba in certain situations).

Ted

Ted

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of ptusing
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 9:42 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: number testing and word testing of vocalizer voices
TomandSamantha

Hi,
I appreciate your comments. I had heard that F S was supposedly
interested in poorly pronounced words or badly pronounced words in
combination. I will give 2 examples.

Both the voices Tom and Samantha mis sp eak some words ending in hard
consonants followed by words beginning with vowels like these 2 word
combinations:
mess around
grandarena
So I was simply attempting to do what was suggested--nothing more.
One person pointed out words beginning with"
aggr".
We will be stuck with this vocalizer synthesizer for sometime.
Have a fine day.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Farfar Carlson" <dgcarlson@sbcglobal.net>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 11:35 PM
Subject: Re: number testing and word testing of vocalizer voices Tom
andSamantha


Your research is laudable, but expecting that the problem lies with
JAWS may not be valid. How do you know that inconsistencies are not
the fault of Nuance?

If you really need to have accurate speech feedback, then your
research seem to indicate that you should stick with Eloquence.


Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 14, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "ptusing" <ptusing@sbcglobal.net>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 18:43
Subject: number testing and word testing of vocalizer voices Tom and
Samantha


Here is a number string andI report how Eloquence reads it.
Numbers are in quotations.
"
2.00 8 1.30 9 .30 7 50 6" but are listed below minusthequotations.

These numbers read literally like
two point oh oh eight one point three oh nine point three oh etc.
until
the last 3 numbers which are 7 then 50 and then 6.
The last numbers are read as seven fifty six.
2.00 8 1.30 9 .30 7 50 6





Now, a friend is testing the vocalizer Tom and Samantha with
3-syllable
words in sentences with lots of punctuationlike commas and dashes.



He is doing this to try to find problems which can be fixed during the
beta.
|

Four syllable words seem good.



Final point,the individual helps peoplewith JAWS which I myself have
found
very useful



I think the Tom voice is slightly muffled but it and Samantha are
the
easiest to listen to for long time periods.



Will keep you posted per the voice experiment.



Have a fine day.


_______________________________________________
Jfw mailing list
Jfw@lists.the-jdh.com
http://lists.the-jdh.com/mailman/listinfo/jfw_lists.the-jdh.com


_______________________________________________
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Jfw@lists.the-jdh.com
http://lists.the-jdh.com/mailman/listinfo/jfw_lists.the-jdh.com

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Re: Freedom Scientific Petition

Adrian Spratt
 

The self-proclaimed seniors in this thread have used computers and
screenreaders since they were, as Ted put it, mere striplings. The elderly
population that is less likely to take on JAWS over, say, sixty consists of
people who haven't used computers at all or who haven't used adaptive aids
while working with computers. Several exceptions from this list alone come
to mind.

The relevance to JAWS is that the deficiencies that start or recur in new
versions are a cause of great frustration even for those of us who have
years of experience with the application. That level of frustration has to
be extremely discouraging to people of any age learning it for the first
time, and especially those who fear their intellectual powers are waning.
All the more reason for Ed's petition.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Cy Selfridge
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 9:52 AM
To: 'The Jaws for Windows support list.'
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition

Hi Ted,
I believe I was just about 40 when I got my Apple II+.
Cy

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Lisle, Ted
(CHFS DMS)
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 6:28 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition

A few of us are seniors now, but were not when we started. I was a mere
stripling of 32 when I saw my first Apple.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 5:15 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


At 62 years of age, I am also a senior and have yet to encounter another
blind senior who uses a computer with JAWS or any other screen reader.
And most older sighted seniors I know want nothing to do with computers,
which they find difficult and confounding to learn and set up.

Gerald


----- Original Message -----
From: "Cy Selfridge" <cyselfridge@comcast.net>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 4:57 PM
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition


Hmm, I am a Senior and I know a whole lot of Seniors who use the
computer
as
it gives us a great way to "get out" and communicate with others.
Now, with the advent of the iPhone and Android a lot of folks who used
to
use the computer now use the phone.
I suppose there are still a lot of blind (as well as other handicapped
people) who are satisfied tojust sit on their asses and veg out.
Cy, The Humble Guy


-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Chris
Smart
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 2:52 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition



how many of those people are seniors? don't forget that probably three
quarters of the visually-impaired population are elderly.

At 04:50 PM 10/7/2012, you wrote:
Very odd statistics... what are they based on? You say less than 10%
of blind people use computers with a screen reader? I'd say that 95%
of the people I know who are blind, and, I know a lot of people who
are
blind, use a computer with a screen reader, and, most of these use
Jaws. I'm not criticizing you, just wonder how you arrive at your
stats.

Russell
Sent from my iMac running Mountain Lion!

On 2012-10-02, at 10:24 AM, Gerald Levy <bwaylimited@verizon.net>
wrote:


There is absolutely no way that two thirds of all blind people
use JAWS. There are an estimated 1.2 million people in the US
classified as legally blind, but only a small fraction, perhaps less
than 10% use computers with screen readers. The overwhelming
majority
of blind people do not use computers, so the actual number of JAWS
users is probably quite small. Also, an estimated 70% of blind people
are unemployed, so they would have little or no means of acquiring
computers or commercial screen readers. And the vast majority of
JAWS
users do not belong to this or other blind-tech related mailing
lists,
so they would have no way of learning about the petition. FS keeps
the number of JAWS customers a closely guarded secret, so nobody
really knows how many blind people are actually using it. But if I
had
to venture a guess, I would say that the number of JAWS users might
be
somewhere between 50,000 and 150,000, but this is only a wild guess
not based on any facts or evidence.

Gerald


----- Original Message ----- From: "Marquette, Ed"
<Ed.Marquette@KutakRock.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 11:45 AM
Subject: Freedom Scientific Petition


All:
As promised, I am about to put the Freedom Scientific "Gimmick
Feature Moratorium" petition up on the Internet. Before doing so, I
have a couple of questions:

1. The Change.org petition form suggests (perhaps requires) a
sign-up goal. I'd be interested in suggestions as to the number of
JAWS users that should sign such a petition to be considered a
success. One of those helping with the drafting of the petition has
information that two thirds of all blind persons use JAWS. Does
anyone have any idea how many people that is? What would be a
reasonable percentage of signers to expect? Looking for suggestions
here. I'm happy to accept responses off-line.
Although this is JAWS-related, I don't want to spark a flurry of
off-topic discussions again.
2. Change.org is, to my way of thinking, a little awkward
when it comes to screen reader usage. It isn't bad, but there are
some less than intuitive prompts. I would like this petition to be
on
the most accessible public petition Website possible. Would anyone
on
the list perhaps know of a site for a public petition that is better
and/or more accessible than is Change.org?
Thanks to the off-line support and drafting assistance. We've
tried to accommodate the views expressed on this list and elsewhere
even though, in some instances, the interests were not always
congruent.
In the petition, we have not cited specific issues. I
actually started to do that, but I wanted to get the petition up
before Christmas. <SMILE>
Thanks for all your help!


I. Edward Marquette
Direct Dial: 816.502.4646
Mobile: 816.812.0088
Google Voice: 408.692.5640
Facsimile: 816.960.0041
Kutak Rock LLP
1010 Grand Boulevard
Suite 500
Kansas City, MO 64106
ed.marquette@kutakrock.com




ANY FEDERAL TAX ADVICE CONTAINED IN THIS MESSAGE SHOULD NOT BE
USED OR REFERRED TO IN THE PROMOTING, MARKETING OR
RECOMMENDING OF ANY ENTITY, INVESTMENT PLAN OR ARRANGEMENT,
AND SUCH ADVICE IS NOT INTENDED OR WRITTEN TO BE USED,
AND CANNOT BE USED, BY A TAXPAYER FOR THE PURPOSE OF AVOIDING
PENALTIES UNDER THE INTERNAL REVENUE CODE.

This E-mail message is confidential, is intended only for the
named recipients above and may contain information
that is privileged, attorney work product or otherwise
protected by applicable law. If you have received this
message in error, please notify the sender at 402-346-6000 and
delete this E-mail message.
Thank you.
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Re: Freedom Scientific Petition

Cy Selfridge
 

Hi Ted,
I believe I was just about 40 when I got my Apple II+.
Cy

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Lisle, Ted
(CHFS DMS)
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 6:28 AM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition

A few of us are seniors now, but were not when we started. I was a mere
stripling of 32 when I saw my first Apple.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 5:15 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


At 62 years of age, I am also a senior and have yet to encounter another
blind senior who uses a computer with JAWS or any other screen reader.
And most older sighted seniors I know want nothing to do with computers,
which they find difficult and confounding to learn and set up.

Gerald


----- Original Message -----
From: "Cy Selfridge" <cyselfridge@comcast.net>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 4:57 PM
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition


Hmm, I am a Senior and I know a whole lot of Seniors who use the
computer
as
it gives us a great way to "get out" and communicate with others.
Now, with the advent of the iPhone and Android a lot of folks who used
to
use the computer now use the phone.
I suppose there are still a lot of blind (as well as other handicapped
people) who are satisfied tojust sit on their asses and veg out.
Cy, The Humble Guy


-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Chris
Smart
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 2:52 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition



how many of those people are seniors? don't forget that probably three
quarters of the visually-impaired population are elderly.

At 04:50 PM 10/7/2012, you wrote:
Very odd statistics... what are they based on? You say less than 10%
of blind people use computers with a screen reader? I'd say that 95%
of the people I know who are blind, and, I know a lot of people who
are
blind, use a computer with a screen reader, and, most of these use
Jaws. I'm not criticizing you, just wonder how you arrive at your
stats.

Russell
Sent from my iMac running Mountain Lion!

On 2012-10-02, at 10:24 AM, Gerald Levy <bwaylimited@verizon.net>
wrote:


There is absolutely no way that two thirds of all blind people
use JAWS. There are an estimated 1.2 million people in the US
classified as legally blind, but only a small fraction, perhaps less
than 10% use computers with screen readers. The overwhelming
majority
of blind people do not use computers, so the actual number of JAWS
users is probably quite small. Also, an estimated 70% of blind people
are unemployed, so they would have little or no means of acquiring
computers or commercial screen readers. And the vast majority of
JAWS
users do not belong to this or other blind-tech related mailing
lists,
so they would have no way of learning about the petition. FS keeps
the number of JAWS customers a closely guarded secret, so nobody
really knows how many blind people are actually using it. But if I
had
to venture a guess, I would say that the number of JAWS users might
be
somewhere between 50,000 and 150,000, but this is only a wild guess
not based on any facts or evidence.

Gerald


----- Original Message ----- From: "Marquette, Ed"
<Ed.Marquette@KutakRock.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 11:45 AM
Subject: Freedom Scientific Petition


All:
As promised, I am about to put the Freedom Scientific "Gimmick
Feature Moratorium" petition up on the Internet. Before doing so, I
have a couple of questions:

1. The Change.org petition form suggests (perhaps requires) a
sign-up goal. I'd be interested in suggestions as to the number of
JAWS users that should sign such a petition to be considered a
success. One of those helping with the drafting of the petition has
information that two thirds of all blind persons use JAWS. Does
anyone have any idea how many people that is? What would be a
reasonable percentage of signers to expect? Looking for suggestions
here. I'm happy to accept responses off-line.
Although this is JAWS-related, I don't want to spark a flurry of
off-topic discussions again.
2. Change.org is, to my way of thinking, a little awkward
when it comes to screen reader usage. It isn't bad, but there are
some less than intuitive prompts. I would like this petition to be
on
the most accessible public petition Website possible. Would anyone
on
the list perhaps know of a site for a public petition that is better
and/or more accessible than is Change.org?
Thanks to the off-line support and drafting assistance. We've
tried to accommodate the views expressed on this list and elsewhere
even though, in some instances, the interests were not always
congruent.
In the petition, we have not cited specific issues. I
actually started to do that, but I wanted to get the petition up
before Christmas. <SMILE>
Thanks for all your help!


I. Edward Marquette
Direct Dial: 816.502.4646
Mobile: 816.812.0088
Google Voice: 408.692.5640
Facsimile: 816.960.0041
Kutak Rock LLP
1010 Grand Boulevard
Suite 500
Kansas City, MO 64106
ed.marquette@kutakrock.com




ANY FEDERAL TAX ADVICE CONTAINED IN THIS MESSAGE SHOULD NOT BE
USED OR REFERRED TO IN THE PROMOTING, MARKETING OR
RECOMMENDING OF ANY ENTITY, INVESTMENT PLAN OR ARRANGEMENT,
AND SUCH ADVICE IS NOT INTENDED OR WRITTEN TO BE USED,
AND CANNOT BE USED, BY A TAXPAYER FOR THE PURPOSE OF AVOIDING
PENALTIES UNDER THE INTERNAL REVENUE CODE.

This E-mail message is confidential, is intended only for the
named recipients above and may contain information
that is privileged, attorney work product or otherwise
protected by applicable law. If you have received this
message in error, please notify the sender at 402-346-6000 and
delete this E-mail message.
Thank you.
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Re: number testing and word testing of vocalizer voices Tom andSamantha

ptusing <ptusing@...>
 

Hi,
I appreciate your comments. I had heard that F S was supposedly interested in poorly pronounced words or badly pronounced words in
combination. I will give 2 examples.

Both the voices Tom and Samantha mis sp eak some words ending in hard consonants followed by words beginning with vowels like
these 2 word combinations:
mess around
grandarena
So I was simply attempting to do what was suggested--nothing more.
One person pointed out words beginning with"
aggr".
We will be stuck with this vocalizer synthesizer for sometime.
Have a fine day.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Farfar Carlson" <dgcarlson@sbcglobal.net>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 11:35 PM
Subject: Re: number testing and word testing of vocalizer voices Tom andSamantha


Your research is laudable, but expecting that the problem lies with JAWS may
not be valid. How do you know that inconsistencies are not the fault of
Nuance?

If you really need to have accurate speech feedback, then your research seem
to indicate that you should stick with Eloquence.


Dave Carlson
Tastefully composed and launched near the Pacific Ocean using a Dell
Latitude E6520, JAWS 14, and Windows 7 Professional 32-bit


----- Original Message -----
From: "ptusing" <ptusing@sbcglobal.net>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 18:43
Subject: number testing and word testing of vocalizer voices Tom and
Samantha


Here is a number string andI report how Eloquence reads it.
Numbers are in quotations.
"
2.00 8 1.30 9 .30 7 50 6" but are listed below minusthequotations.

These numbers read literally like
two point oh oh eight one point three oh nine point three oh etc. until
the last 3 numbers which are 7 then 50 and then 6.
The last numbers are read as seven fifty six.
2.00 8 1.30 9 .30 7 50 6





Now, a friend is testing the vocalizer Tom and Samantha with 3-syllable
words in sentences with lots of punctuationlike commas and dashes.



He is doing this to try to find problems which can be fixed during the beta.
|

Four syllable words seem good.



Final point,the individual helps peoplewith JAWS which I myself have found
very useful



I think the Tom voice is slightly muffled but it and Samantha are the
easiest to listen to for long time periods.



Will keep you posted per the voice experiment.



Have a fine day.


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Re: Freedom Scientific Petition

Lisle, Ted (CHFS DMS)
 

A few of us are seniors now, but were not when we started. I was a mere
stripling of 32 when I saw my first Apple.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Gerald
Levy
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 5:15 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition


At 62 years of age, I am also a senior and have yet to encounter another
blind senior who uses a computer with JAWS or any other screen reader.
And most older sighted seniors I know want nothing to do with computers,
which they find difficult and confounding to learn and set up.

Gerald


----- Original Message -----
From: "Cy Selfridge" <cyselfridge@comcast.net>
To: "'The Jaws for Windows support list.'" <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 4:57 PM
Subject: RE: Freedom Scientific Petition


Hmm, I am a Senior and I know a whole lot of Seniors who use the
computer
as
it gives us a great way to "get out" and communicate with others.
Now, with the advent of the iPhone and Android a lot of folks who used
to
use the computer now use the phone.
I suppose there are still a lot of blind (as well as other handicapped
people) who are satisfied tojust sit on their asses and veg out.
Cy, The Humble Guy


-----Original Message-----
From: Jfw [mailto:jfw-bounces@lists.the-jdh.com] On Behalf Of Chris
Smart
Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2012 2:52 PM
To: The Jaws for Windows support list.
Subject: Re: Freedom Scientific Petition



how many of those people are seniors? don't forget that probably three
quarters of the visually-impaired population are elderly.

At 04:50 PM 10/7/2012, you wrote:
Very odd statistics... what are they based on? You say less than 10%
of blind people use computers with a screen reader? I'd say that 95%
of the people I know who are blind, and, I know a lot of people who
are
blind, use a computer with a screen reader, and, most of these use
Jaws. I'm not criticizing you, just wonder how you arrive at your
stats.

Russell
Sent from my iMac running Mountain Lion!

On 2012-10-02, at 10:24 AM, Gerald Levy <bwaylimited@verizon.net>
wrote:


There is absolutely no way that two thirds of all blind people
use JAWS. There are an estimated 1.2 million people in the US
classified as legally blind, but only a small fraction, perhaps less
than 10% use computers with screen readers. The overwhelming
majority
of blind people do not use computers, so the actual number of JAWS
users is probably quite small. Also, an estimated 70% of blind people
are unemployed, so they would have little or no means of acquiring
computers or commercial screen readers. And the vast majority of
JAWS
users do not belong to this or other blind-tech related mailing
lists,
so they would have no way of learning about the petition. FS keeps
the number of JAWS customers a closely guarded secret, so nobody
really knows how many blind people are actually using it. But if I
had
to venture a guess, I would say that the number of JAWS users might
be
somewhere between 50,000 and 150,000, but this is only a wild guess
not based on any facts or evidence.

Gerald


----- Original Message ----- From: "Marquette, Ed"
<Ed.Marquette@KutakRock.com>
To: "The Jaws for Windows support list." <jfw@lists.the-jdh.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 11:45 AM
Subject: Freedom Scientific Petition


All:
As promised, I am about to put the Freedom Scientific "Gimmick
Feature Moratorium" petition up on the Internet. Before doing so, I
have a couple of questions:

1. The Change.org petition form suggests (perhaps requires) a
sign-up goal. I'd be interested in suggestions as to the number of
JAWS users that should sign such a petition to be considered a
success. One of those helping with the drafting of the petition has
information that two thirds of all blind persons use JAWS. Does
anyone have any idea how many people that is? What would be a
reasonable percentage of signers to expect? Looking for suggestions
here. I'm happy to accept responses off-line.
Although this is JAWS-related, I don't want to spark a flurry of
off-topic discussions again.
2. Change.org is, to my way of thinking, a little awkward
when it comes to screen reader usage. It isn't bad, but there are
some less than intuitive prompts. I would like this petition to be
on
the most accessible public petition Website possible. Would anyone
on
the list perhaps know of a site for a public petition that is better
and/or more accessible than is Change.org?
Thanks to the off-line support and drafting assistance. We've
tried to accommodate the views expressed on this list and elsewhere
even though, in some instances, the interests were not always
congruent.
In the petition, we have not cited specific issues. I
actually started to do that, but I wanted to get the petition up
before Christmas. <SMILE>
Thanks for all your help!


I. Edward Marquette
Direct Dial: 816.502.4646
Mobile: 816.812.0088
Google Voice: 408.692.5640
Facsimile: 816.960.0041
Kutak Rock LLP
1010 Grand Boulevard
Suite 500
Kansas City, MO 64106
ed.marquette@kutakrock.com




ANY FEDERAL TAX ADVICE CONTAINED IN THIS MESSAGE SHOULD NOT BE
USED OR REFERRED TO IN THE PROMOTING, MARKETING OR
RECOMMENDING OF ANY ENTITY, INVESTMENT PLAN OR ARRANGEMENT,
AND SUCH ADVICE IS NOT INTENDED OR WRITTEN TO BE USED,
AND CANNOT BE USED, BY A TAXPAYER FOR THE PURPOSE OF AVOIDING
PENALTIES UNDER THE INTERNAL REVENUE CODE.

This E-mail message is confidential, is intended only for the
named recipients above and may contain information
that is privileged, attorney work product or otherwise
protected by applicable law. If you have received this
message in error, please notify the sender at 402-346-6000 and
delete this E-mail message.
Thank you.
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Twitter: https://twitter.com/#!/CTSMASTERING
BLOG: www.ctsmastering.com/blog
Linked In: http://ca.linkedin.com/pub/chris-smart/46/824/536


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